The Facebook debacle & other issues

@forged_in_mess

At the end of the day, this is why you have disclaimer for the products.

"Our products have been made to fit our own other products, your results may vary if you are using these on other brand items."

This is picking a random new order. Vetting it, and denying it -- granted maybe denying it only based on the item being used on a different brand of item, but without any consideration or willingness to find out that the customer might already aknowledge that their end results might vary.

And just so you know, my family has some experience in retail and storekeeping, so im not that distanced from the concept of difficult customers.

And also while participating in said functions, you cant judge a book by its cover -- also if some urban legend customer stories are to be believed.

1 hour ago, forged_in_mess said:

On top of that, I believe that seller should always have right to refuse sales. For example when I had a customer who was a typical "Karen", i would rather refuse sales than deal with bs afterwards. 

If it were a Karen, then it's understandable, like that time he refunded the customer who wanted everything to be "perfect" for her doll. But now he's taking the initiative to email people to check on what dolls they have, and what they plan to use their purchases for, and then cancelling said purchases if he doesn't approve of their answers. That's far from reasonable.

1 hour ago, forged_in_mess said:

I think, that it's as well the exclusivity of the item. Making a ideology around how you need to stay in brand, same as any apple products. It's not something that unusual, if brand want to be seen as not as easily obtainable - its more of a elite thing, and people love to be a part of some elites. To belong. 

I would say there are many who live in fear that something goes wrong with their order, or they might inadvertently say/post something that offends Danny's delicate sensibilities and end up being banned from his store forever (and that's after being thrown to the sharks that are the most ardent of his fanbase). If one has a problem with a purchase and their first instinct is to keep quiet out of fear, rather than approach customer service to clarify (not even to ask for a refund or anything, but merely to CLARIFY), then I must say it's a really toxic sort of ideology to cultivate around a brand that has any intention of flourishing.

2 hours ago, bbotss said:

I would say there are many who live in fear that something goes wrong with their order, or they might inadvertently say/post something that offends Danny's delicate sensibilities and end up being banned from his store forever (and that's after being thrown to the sharks that are the most ardent of his fanbase). If one has a problem with a purchase and their first instinct is to keep quiet out of fear, rather than approach customer service to clarify (not even to ask for a refund or anything, but merely to CLARIFY), then I must say it's a really toxic sort of ideology to cultivate around a brand that has any intention of flourishing.

That actually sounds worse than I thought. I like to think that I'm rational, and as a "artist", I know that there is a group expecting a factory perfection from items, and that is what blocks me from putting my wigs or eyes for sale, because I see small flaws and I'm worried that they won't be good enough for customer.

But there is a difference from something being broken and actually needing replaced than a normal small flaws. And I would like to believe that I would be able to contact company about product that's defective. 

I don't like that smart doll doesn't offer only blank heads and isn't transparent with sculpts. I can see from the company view, that they have more income from selling already painted dolls, as putting a mask and spraying face up isn't that expensive and adds plenty of value to the final product. Don't like it, but can understand. 

20 minutes ago, forged_in_mess said:

That actually sounds worse than I thought. I like to think that I'm rational, and as a "artist", I know that there is a group expecting a factory perfection from items, and that is what blocks me from putting my wigs or eyes for sale, because I see small flaws and I'm worried that they won't be good enough for customer.

But there is a difference from something being broken and actually needing replaced than a normal small flaws. And I would like to believe that I would be able to contact company about product that's defective. 

Thats not an unreasonable mindset to have if you are a one person shop doing bespoke single items, but culture japan is making itself out to be more than that.

They have serial production of items, so in this sense standards and expectations are bound, and should be higher. -- and all those shiny HDR product pictures add to this expectation.

If you are a single person shop, if you find problems with your work but still wish to market it -- if you are very open and honest about these issues you've found, I doubt any sane customer would look at you with any contempt -- and at least if you've for example given photo's of the issues before hand, no customer can say that they werent told about it before buying.

If quality issues are a worry, it then boils down to tempering customer expectations. As an example, Coolcats has (or at least had) a few pictures about their lame-fabric items, that what is to be expected as a possible defect in the items, and what are problems that you might end up causing as an end user, and what might actually be exchanged.

In culture japans case it seems like, as a possible customer, you are expected to tolerate any random kind of defect that just happens to end up in your order (sarcastically speaking to the point where some people might be making bingo-sheets on the topic.)

and as bbots mentioned just reaching out about any random defect has a good chance of resulting in a possible temper-tantrum - or worse letting loose the social media side of things.

and also as it seems to be happening, even factory efforts get it wrong, I've had to fix several wig issues with my volks dolls -- things I might have gotten exchanged if id gone through the hastle of exchanging them. I've posted about the issues and what I've done to rectify them myself very openly here, but I havent had to worry about backlash from doing so -- This is not gauranteed with culture japan, and there seems to be evidence that if you do any negative press about them, you get the banhammer.

And again I will admit, there are problem customers that will never be satisfied no matter how you bend over backwards -- but at the end of the day if you set up a global company trying to sell to "the most diverse customerbase ever" thats something a company effort will have to accept to deal with.

1 hour ago, forged_in_mess said:

That actually sounds worse than I thought. I like to think that I'm rational, and as a "artist", I know that there is a group expecting a factory perfection from items, and that is what blocks me from putting my wigs or eyes for sale, because I see small flaws and I'm worried that they won't be good enough for customer.

You could consider grading your items according to the flaws, like Grade A for perfect, B for slight flaws and so on. I see independent artists do this all the time, and not just in the BJD industry.

For the CJ situation, I'm not sure if you were aware that someone once received a doll without the lower lashes painted on. When they posted asking for advice, the majority of responses was more along the lines of "wow, wabi-sabi, you got a ooak doll" than "hey, that's clearly a defect, you should contact customer service about it". To be fair Danny did send a replacement head, but what I found alarming is the instinctive response by his fans to twist the definition of what is clearly a defective item. And this is just my personal opinion, but I think Danny couldn't use wabi-sabi as the excuse for the head because then even his fans might balk at the possibility of receiving and having to accept a defective head. After all, the stock faceups do seem to be the selling point of the dolls.

To be fair, I do understand issues of wanting to make sure you have items in stock for your brand, and trying to temper expectations of products.

 

But there's several principles, I personally feel he should be following.

 

1. K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple, Stupid. - the philosophy that sometimes you need to be short an to the point. His lectures, descriptions are far beyond what needs to be stated on product pages.

 

2. Autonomy over Micro Managing - At a certain point he has to realize that micro managing your customers is making them more unhappy vs allowing a certain level of autonomy. People are happier at work when someone isn't breathing over their every move and allow more freedom of decision making. The same is said for customers. No, they aren't always right - but you need to allow them autonomy over the final decision of purchasing products. The more you micro manage that decision, the less happy people become.

By the way, I saw on an insta story a receipt for the item--she was purchasing a harness for her mdd. I don't know if that changes anything for you all... To me it's a bummer, because the mdd was outfitted like a little miner, a harness would have looked so cool and cute! And the purchaser was willing to pay over a hundred dollars for it...

To me, this is nothing more than Danny trying to gatekeep--you can only use this cool accessory if you've bought one of my 600 dollar dolls. 

2 hours ago, littlecherishdoll said:

To me it's a bummer, because the mdd was outfitted like a little miner, a harness would have looked so cool and cute! And the purchaser was willing to pay over a hundred dollars for it...

While technically he has the right, this isn’t ok. 

I find that so weird on another level. It deters people from buying gifts from Smart Doll.

 

And buying gifts shouldn't be an exercise of dealing with the Soup Nazi from Seinfeld

(apologies if use of "Nazi" brings up bad blood from the FB incident that started this thread but I  mean it's literally the character from Seinfeld that comes to mind -No Soup for You!)

 

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by Q_T

33 minutes ago, Q_T said:

(apologies if use of "Nazi" brings up bad blood from the FB incident that started this thread but I  mean it's literally the character from Seinfeld that comes to mind -No Soup for You!)

That analogy has been used earlier in the thread, and to my recollection no one objected.

2 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

That analogy has been used earlier in the thread, and to my recollection no one objected.

Not going to lie on one note, that would make a great youtube skit, making a doll version of it. 

5 hours ago, Q_T said:

Not going to lie on one note, that would make a great youtube skit, making a doll version of it. 

I almost said the same XD if anyone has video or acting skills it would be pretty on point haha

Reading the most recent replies, I did have a thought that we as consumers must be protected from some of this (to be frank) bs that Smart Doll has been pulling recently.

For example, the "disclaimer" on the 'Only the Brave' page that clearly states upon reading it that one would recieve a $500 pebble when in actuality it is a lucky dip bag for a doll (maybe?). According to this article this is in breach of  the 'Act against Unjustifiable Premiums and Misleading Representations' which really dopes what it says on the tin; and the 'Only the Brave' is inarguably misrepresented. I got my SO to read it, who is entirely unfamiliar with Smart Doll, and he actually thought they were selling pebbles.

The mistranslated Volks Tweet may fall under 'Designation of Unfair Trade Practices (Fair Trade Commission Public Notice No. 15 of June 18, 1982)' linked here which states

Quote

(8) Unjustly inducing customers of a competitor to trade with oneself by causing them to misunderstand that the substance of goods or services supplied by oneself, or its trade terms, or other matters relevant to such trade are much better or much more favorable than the actual ones or than those pertaining to the competitor.

Personally messaging folks to check if they have purchased before, depending on the platforms used (i.e. instagram/facebook) may constitute breaches of privacy or mishandling of personal information as you must give them your email to make an order.

This is just a few examples, and I know Japan has a different policy for returning goods (i.e. You can't without good reason, like a fault). However, Japan is also bound by UN Trade Guidelines, and possibly local laws depending on how they are written. Lastly, as cheesy as this sounds, know your consumer rights when you buy from SD as if you find yourself at the bad end of one of these awful transactions I've been reading about, then you may well find you can pursue legal action should you desire.

*Disclaimer* I am not a lawyer, I have studied consumer rights very briefly and have aided in the operation of a small business where I was required to know UK/EU Consumer Rights.

On 9/16/2020 at 1:08 PM, RainbowNanaki said:

Yeah... I recently had to cut contact with someone who makes Smart Doll patterns because she was legitimately upset that I was bothered by order cancellations — even though my own very first Smart Doll order would have been cancelled under new rules — and accused me of choosing sides + forcing her to pick between a company and friendship. While I have not seen her applying that ideology to the patterns + clothes she sells, it wouldn't surprise me if she started. Also, I want to be clear, my original message was just along the lines of "oof, looks like more CJ orders are being cancelled other than Chaos/OTB due to someone not owing a Smart Doll."

That said, anything that isn't super tailored can definitely be shared across brands. Both my Smart Doll and Dollfie Dream Sister share significant portions of their wardrobes, and most of the incompatibility comes from DDS using an SS bust. My DDS has several pieces of official Smart Doll clothing, my Smart Doll wears a bunch of Volks stuff, and both wear clothes made for SD resin girls made by peeps on Etsy. While some things may only fit a specific body, it is hardly everything. People should be able to own things by both brands!

Is this someone that sells patterns? If possible, would you mind PMing the name? I buy patterns to make things for my Dollfie Dreams, but I'd rather avoid them if that's their attitude

@seirenmachina

The thing with the pebbles, is that it sort of goes into raffle territory -- and as such I dont think can really be brought into direct misrepresentation.

However ... to polish my tin foil hat, if this option were to be used against a customer intentionally, that opens up another door of opportunity.

For instance, if an existing customer happened to cross senpai accidentally somehow in many possible ways, and senpai took notice of this -- The customer then goes for the pebble option, and senpai actually sends the rock in spite -- and will tout the message "Well you went in risking a rock, didnt you?"

Though if I recall there also was a thing years ago when a person was looking at Xbox consoles on ebay, found a Buy it now listing -- bought it, and did not really even read the title of, "Picture of Xbox". Shinenigans ensued, and ebay was actually ruling in favor to the seller, because they had not misrepresented the item at all, and it was all down to not reading the description and title -- but ebay nullified the deal non the less, because obvious reasons.

The other maybe with the pebble thing is, if there might be a newsletter of sorts going around stating when would be a good time to participate in this perticular raffle for extra special goodies -- is a bit iffish, but not an outright foul.

--

<sarcasm> however... as it is ... any act of misrepresentation will be met with stern wapisapi that dissolves all problems... </sarcasm>

Just to correct a bit of misinformation in this thread, the original story abt the cancelled order came from akatsuki_lemon and was abt a friend of theirs, not macar00ni. Doesn't change what happened, but thought y'all should know 

15 hours ago, finnleo said:

@seirenmachina

The thing with the pebbles, is that it sort of goes into raffle territory -- and as such I dont think can really be brought into direct misrepresentation.

However ... to polish my tin foil hat, if this option were to be used against a customer intentionally, that opens up another door of opportunity.

For instance, if an existing customer happened to cross senpai accidentally somehow in many possible ways, and senpai took notice of this -- The customer then goes for the pebble option, and senpai actually sends the rock in spite -- and will tout the message "Well you went in risking a rock, didnt you?"

Though if I recall there also was a thing years ago when a person was looking at Xbox consoles on ebay, found a Buy it now listing -- bought it, and did not really even read the title of, "Picture of Xbox". Shinenigans ensued, and ebay was actually ruling in favor to the seller, because they had not misrepresented the item at all, and it was all down to not reading the description and title -- but ebay nullified the deal non the less, because obvious reasons.

The other maybe with the pebble thing is, if there might be a newsletter of sorts going around stating when would be a good time to participate in this perticular raffle for extra special goodies -- is a bit iffish, but not an outright foul.

--

<sarcasm> however... as it is ... any act of misrepresentation will be met with stern wapisapi that dissolves all problems... </sarcasm>

You could be right. I honestly don't know much about raffles outside the UK, but here it becomes gambling law rather than commercial law. It might also be different as you're not so much selling individual tickets for a set prize, but more like a lucky dip where you're guaranteed a prize but you don't know what. (Probably why entering the Volks lottery is free)

It shouldn't be this hard to buy a product, and a consumer should know exactly what they're getting within a reasonable scope (for handmade items and lucky dips).

The Ebay things is... Yeah. It happens... Legally the guy is in the right as the onus is on the buyer to read the description of what they're buying. But the Smart Doll one is different imo. The thing with the 'Only the Brave' page is that if you didn't know you would get a doll, and you bought it and recieved one; that's misrepresentation. WE know its for a mystery doll. Someone just entering the Smart Doll website thinks they're getting a pebble. It states there's an extremely slim chance of you getting a doll as the very last line but otherwise you're buying a doorstop.

I hope that made sense?

Honestly the only way I'd buy a Smart Doll after looking at this thread is secondhand from here/mandarake/YJA or in person where I can check it before I leave the store (and hopefully deal with a nice staff member not Senpai) 😊

7 hours ago, SeirenMachina said:

Honestly the only way I'd buy a Smart Doll after looking at this thread is secondhand from here/mandarake/YJA or in person where I can check it before I leave the store (and hopefully deal with a nice staff member not Senpai) 😊

I am fully planning on sneaking into the Smartdoll Store next time I go to Japan. Not sure if I'll actually buy anything, since I can only fit so many dolls in my suitcase and I could probably get an entire Volks outfit for the price of one piece of clothing there...but it looks fun. (Maybe they'll have the spare parts bin out or some kind of DIY kit.)

8 hours ago, SeirenMachina said:

WE know its for a mystery doll. Someone just entering the Smart Doll website thinks they're getting a pebble. It states there's an extremely slim chance of you getting a doll as the very last line but otherwise you're buying a doorstop.

I hope that made sense?

mmm, I very much understood where you were coming from... I guess its probably my stance that I think there are other things going on that in my opinion that might need more attention, that also do go into the realm of consumer rights -- especially after sales support.

The pebble thing is for instance locked behind having to have bought an item before, so by then you might have actually gotten a better idea what its about.

In my opinion a bigger misrepresentation issue is how the company claims superiority over other manufacturers, having the shiny virtual storefront showcasing what a premium product they supposedly have, but at the same time they expect their customers to accept "handmade defects" because wasabi this, and wapisapi that -- that in some of these cases brought up here is just up to poor quality control. Yes, they are hand made, but they are serial production hand made, which means you end up with B-stock with even the best of times ... but there are better ways of dealing with this than trying your luck by pushing it on customers with some hokey concepts that wouldnt fly in certain manufacturing fields.

 

44 minutes ago, monkeypizzasonic said:

I am fully planning on sneaking into the Smartdoll Store next time I go to Japan.

With all the latest shinenigans, why wouldnt I be surprised if they had a 300 pound grizzly bear of a bouncer waiting at the door, asking for proof of purchase before entering the property.   (roll the indiana jones 3 Tickets please bit... "No ticket...")

 

15 minutes ago, finnleo said:

wasabi

Mmmm, chocolate covered wasabi.

1 hour ago, finnleo said:

With all the latest shinenigans, why wouldnt I be surprised if they had a 300 pound grizzly bear of a bouncer waiting at the door, asking for proof of purchase before entering the property.   (roll the indiana jones 3 Tickets please bit... "No ticket...")

 

Oh man, now I can't wait for my trip to Japan in February (provided the travel doesn't get pushed back) because I'd PAY to see a bear at the front door. But it will be interesting seeing what the store is like face to face. Honestly I mostly just want the ability to see the SmD Plus face to face and to get to root around the chaos outlet by hand instead of waiting for see what mystery meat you get sent to you.

Also I looked up that "No ticket" scene after you mentioned it and I got a good laugh out of it. XD

Slight change of subject, but, did anyone else notice that suddenly all Milk out of stock option parts became "No plans to restock"??

"Hey guys no worries I won't discontinue Milk, you can buy your dolls and parts normally whenever."

Everyone is relieved and keeps saving and preparing their doll projects normally.

"Hey guys so I'm discontinuing Milk but it will take some time so no worries about stock. And you will still be able to buy option parts and when licensed dolls are released."

Everyone panics and most Milk option parts are sold out within days by people who can afford to drop money for dolls whenever. They read "Back soon-ish", so the rest of us wait patiently for a restock while saving up.

Haha nevermind they're just gone now so good luck in the second hand market I guess.

I am very frustrated. It's not the discontinuation per se, it's the fact that he reassured us he wouldn't discontinue Milk and then did it anyway weeks/months later. And then he reassured us they would still make parts for a while and just never did that after the initial panic buying.

Once again I feel left out and less valued as a customer because I can't drop hundreds of dollars on a whim, and I can't plan ahead if he changes his mind about releases, policies and purchase rules every other week. 

 

1 hour ago, LuluChan said:

Slight change of subject, but, did anyone else notice that suddenly all Milk out of stock option parts became "No plans to restock"??

Yeah, that was a punch in the gut for me as well. As far as I remember the word was: "at least as long as we're putting out licensed characters in Milk":

Bummer, because I was waiting on the Hand Pack 4 to restock.

Makes you wonder if the collaboration dolls got axed? C.C. is still listed (for now) but there's been hardly any news on Shiki or any other Japan based collab dolls since the Insta-post above. This may be due to Corona or not...

Maybe we'll get a limited rerun of Milk parts when C.C. eventually hits, but I won't be holding my breath.

mm, well if that post is to be believed, that one year accidental coverage is at least something ... though that wording does leave bits for interpretation ... but I am a cynic after all...

ie. Not "a full body gaurantee for a year".

Edited September 23, 2020 by finnleo

At this point, if I wanted a C.C. I'd just buy a Kanata in the palest colour I could get my hands on, and get a green wig. Yeah, I know it's not the same, or the point... (tbh wouldn't be surprised if the license expired. And why all the super old anime licenses anyway? Danny was teasing Death Note too. Wonder if what's on Netflix has anything to do with it XD )

I really hope my negative take isn't the case, and that people will get their C.C.s eventually.  It really sucks that milk is gone, as that's more typical anime skin colour*. (Yeah, I know, it's gone because reasons...)

(cinnamon keeps confusing me, 'cos my brain says cinnamon is darker than tea lol. I wish there was a middle shade between tea and cocoa... like coffee?)

*more typical when you grow up reading shoujo manga and spend far too long playing Persona games. My sordid anime, uh, present lol.