The Facebook debacle & other issues

On 8/3/2022 at 5:53 PM, ladyandlion said:

But I suppose it all depends on the topic at hand and what will be the straw that broke the camel's back in terms of turning off his followers to the point of boycotting Smart Dolls.

Suspiciously "Attention-getting" isn't it? 

Definitive proof that either he, or, one of his many "followers" (flunkies) read this post on a consistent basis.

We give him too much ammo..... 

I don’t agree with that (edit: that being making this thread members only) personally. This seems to be one of the only places that can serve as a record of things Choo has said and done, seeing as it isn’t allowed in any smartdoll communities. Personally, I would rather anyone be able to know about and access this than hide it away.

I do think its a better idea for some people to not get carried away with bloating the discussion with pointless one-liners that contribute nothing, as it makes it easy for the diehard fans to point at this thread and label it a bunch of trolls (not that all the commentary is bad but it feels to me like some users are just posting the same thing over and over) but at its core the purpose has always been to me  a continually updated record of all the nonsense Mr Choo has pulled, including what I consider important testimony from affected people. I don’t think anyone expected the nonsense to go on for so long it would last 120 and more pages though…

Anyway, I saw his latest tantrum with the boycot smartdoll thing and rolled my eyes a lot, especially the line ‘I would rather starve than sell to the entitled’. Mr Choo, if you didn’t continually expand the definition of what counts as ‘entitled’ every other week you wouldn’t have that problem. (Not to mention how eyebrow raising it is that this definition now seems to be including ‘Jewish people who don’t appreciate the combo of red arm bands, certain stances and gleeful commentary about eradicating ‘infestations’ among that definition, stay classy smartdoll) 

edit: The ‘boycott smartdoll’ thing is on Instagram, there is a post summarising the issue that I’ve seen shared to a bunch of stories lately. The post also included those hashtags. However the person who made it said that the hashtags don’t actually work, attributing this to some action Danny has taken. I didn’t know this was even possible, does it mean Danny complained to Instagram themselves to make the hashtags not work? I don’t know enough about Instagram to know if that’s an actual thing that can be done.

Edited August 9, 2022 by Monty

3 minutes ago, Monty said:

I do think its a better idea for some people to not get carried away with bloating the discussion with pointless one-liners that contribute nothing, as it makes it easy for the diehard fans to point at this thread and label it a bunch of trolls, but at its core the purpose has always been to me  a continually updated record of all the nonsense Mr Choo has pulled, including what I consider important testimony from affected people. I don’t think anyone expected the nonsense to go on for so long it would last 120 and more pages though…

I do agree with you on that, and, I'm also quite guilty of a few (or more)of those pointless one-liners, and i'll unabashedly own each and every one of them.

Mostly, it's to lessen the disgust I feel about this whole situation, from seeing honest complaints being ridiculed, to wholesale banhammering. 

If my (obviously not constructive) comments didn't contribute to the topic as a whole, I do appreciate it being brought to my attention. Thank you. 

I'll still stand by my statement that Unregistered Guests that read this post, have obviously (above "boycott" post) ran off to yell and complain to a certain person.

I'm just as tired as anyone here that has an honest complaint, or fear of not being able to buy an SmD runs that risk of being "preempted" by an outside source. 

I do hope this makes a bit more sense of how I feel about the situation, I never intended to belittle anyone's hardships over any of this. 

 

Battrastard, you’re good. I wasn’t thinking of your posts specifically.

Anyway in my post I mentioned a line where Danny said he would ‘rather starve’, and that line is curiously gone now. I’m not sure when the edit was made but I definitely remember reading it, because I thought it was such a bizarrely dramatic thing to say. Not sure why he seemed to think the same enough to take it back but not the rest.
 

Unfortunately this whole incident is just the latest example of him manufacturing a new narrative out of ‘what really happened’ and his fanbase buying it hook line and sinker again. I know I shouldn’t be surprised anymore but somehow it always does strike me how obsessively this guy -lies-. Just…over and over and over again. 
edit: to clarify just in case - the lie I’m talking about is his version of why people were offended, not the existence of the boycott smartdoll thing which does exist (although it’s just one post that has been shared to Instagram Stories many times…too bad he didn’t actually read that post and learn a thing or too about the reason people are mad but that would require admitting he was wrong about something.)

Edited August 9, 2022 by Monty

Pffft. Bets on how long it takes him to slam me with the ban hammer once he reads some of the comments I made on that Facebook post. Just explaining in great detail why this boycott is supposedly happening. 
 

also, I agree. Where is the proof??? So far the only place I’ve seen it is on that post. 

1 hour ago, Monty said:

Unfortunately this whole incident is just the latest example of him manufacturing a new narrative out of ‘what really happened’ and his fanbase buying it hook line and sinker again. I know I shouldn’t be surprised anymore but somehow it always does strike me how obsessively this guy -lies-. Just…over and over and over again. 

This is why, as stressful as Smart Doll ownership is, I'd vote for keeping the thread public. We could maybe make a separate post telling people about infosec if they want to post here a little more safely. Although anyone that's already had a run in with Danny is gonna be known to him.

If we privated it, we would be protecting ourselves. But keeping it public, we give space to others. And people already know about this thread, and there's nothing to stop malicious people signing up to read it.

I definitely understand the impulse to want to keep it private.

I'm not gonna lie, the boycott smartdoll chibis are hilarious. I actually kind of like them.

On the Facebook post, people are assuming it's about scalpers, and Danny isn't correcting them or clarifying anything. As usual, being vague and showing 0 proof of anything other than "I said it so it's true lol".

I also tried to read your comment @Stormlight and I couldn't find it, I guess he must have blocked you or something like that, so it doesn't show up. 

I wouldn't make this thread private. 

What might benefit people is making a summary of all the main issues addressed in this thread. Because I can imagine that reading 130+ pages might be daunting for some people. 

27 minutes ago, LuluChan said:

On the Facebook post, people are assuming it's about scalpers, and Danny isn't correcting them or clarifying anything. As usual, being vague and showing 0 proof of anything other than "I said it so it's true lol".

I also tried to read your comment @Stormlight and I couldn't find it, I guess he must have blocked you or something like that, so it doesn't show up. 

He restricted the comments to certain people too, so maybe he removed it and then restricted it.

I’ve been sent the boycott smartdoll post by many this morning. It looks like some people are speculating it’s scalping while others are saying it’s because of racism or ableism (which is what Danny basically accused me / people upset about the outfit of)

 

he has turned off comments from what I’ve been told so people can’t even correct these false accusations anymore.

44 minutes ago, Eiko82 said:

I wouldn't make this thread private. 

What might benefit people is making a summary of all the main issues addressed in this thread. Because I can imagine that reading 130+ pages might be daunting for some people. 

I think this is a good idea, although I’m not sure who is up to the task. Maybe it would be good to have a separate thread for the timeline of issues without commentary, just completely neutral and unbiased list of things that have happened, without commentary (with the commentary continuing here). Maybe each issue could have a link to the relevant page of this thread too.

still blows my mind that such a thing as a ‘safe space’ for addressing incidents is even necessary for a doll company, but this is what happens when a CEO creates a community so hostile to any form of critique.

1 hour ago, LuluChan said:

On the Facebook post, people are assuming it's about scalpers, and Danny isn't correcting them or clarifying anything. As usual, being vague and showing 0 proof of anything other than "I said it so it's true lol".

I also tried to read your comment @Stormlight and I couldn't find it, I guess he must have blocked you or something like that, so it doesn't show up. 

Seems like he restricted my ability to comment so my comments might be blocked by now. I can still see them though. lol. I’m honestly stunned he hasn’t outright blocked me from the page yet. 
 

My name on Facebook is Shauna Houser, in case that makes a difference. 

Edited August 9, 2022 by Stormlight

6 minutes ago, Monty said:

Maybe it would be good to have a separate thread for the timeline of issues without commentary, just completely neutral and unbiased list of things that have happened

A sticky post might do, with a title "Before reading the debacle thread, read this."

As for the latest shinenigan...

I think the boycott campaign is a focus shift, as in trying to turn the whole issue from himself towards the whole main company brand and whatnot things related to it.

As if the product has been the main problem, and not the producer.

which is a bit sigh-worthy again, although at least this time there is no messenger to get caught in the crossfire.

anyhoo... since we were doing the whole not-so-funny but-maybe-funny things:

 

1 hour ago, Eiko82 said:

I wouldn't make this thread private. 

What might benefit people is making a summary of all the main issues addressed in this thread. Because I can imagine that reading 130+ pages might be daunting for some people. 

If more people are up to it, each person could do a set of pages to read through (like person 1 does page 1-10, person 2 11-20, etc). Then send all the issues to one person who can make the info list. I doubt anyone would have the time to dig through 131 pages and find all the issues, make a list, post it etc. But yeah, a summary would be good. 

6 hours ago, battrastard said:

Just a wild thought, but, what if we could have this topic (and the "Toxic SmartDoll Community") be "Members Only" viewable, kinda like the Marketplace.

I did think about locking the thread. Not because people are doing anything wrong right now, but because I worry we feed into his ego with all this. We've become the 'entitled' army he references in his tone deaf posts. What we say out loud here may actually injure him less at this point than complete silence would. Without people crying out in outrage at his antics he might start to feel like he doesn't exist. Influencers often seem to thrive on controversy, so take away the controversy and you take away a big chunk of his ability to enthrall his audience.

I didn't because I fundamentally agree with what @Monty said. 

6 hours ago, Monty said:

This seems to be one of the only places that can serve as a record of things Choo has said and done, seeing as it isn’t allowed in any smartdoll communities. Personally, I would rather anyone be able to know about and access this than hide it away.

I'm also in favor of free speech. 
 

6 hours ago, Monty said:

I do think its a better idea for some people to not get carried away with bloating the discussion with pointless one-liners that contribute nothing, as it makes it easy for the diehard fans to point at this thread and label it a bunch of trolls

This is a valid point. Discussion around policy and mistakes is fine, but adding in comments that look like trolling feed into the "entitled" narrative. 

It makes it too easy for him to cherry pick the things that support his own narrative about being persecuted and bullied, and 99% of the people who read his comments will never come back to this thread to get the full context. We've had a few of those show up here with no idea what started all of this, and who were just expecting to find a group of trolls. 
 

1 hour ago, finnleo said:

A sticky post might do, with a title "Before reading the debacle thread, read this."

We could sticky something if needed, but if someone is going to write something up I'd recommend including links to sources within the thread and on the internet. Paint a clear picture with data. 

Also Danny or someone else for him can still subscribe to this forum and read it, there is no point .

And it's very useful for everyone searching information.

46 minutes ago, BeyondTime said:

expecting to find a group of trolls

 

All things considered, that almost warrants some kind of a Moomin reference...

8 hours ago, Monty said:

Anyway in my post I mentioned a line where Danny said he would ‘rather starve’, and that line is curiously gone now. I’m not sure when the edit was made but I definitely remember reading it, because I thought it was such a bizarrely dramatic thing to say. Not sure why he seemed to think the same enough to take it back but not the rest.

I know I shouldn’t be surprised anymore but somehow it always does strike me how obsessively this guy -lies-. Just…over and over and over again. 

 I'm pretty sure he suffers from a certain self-centered personality style. The signs include:

• Grandiose sense of self-importance
• Lives in a fantasy world that supports their delusions of grandeur
• Needs constant praise and admiration
• Sense of entitlement
• Exploits others without guilt or shame
• Frequently demeans, intimidates, bullies, or belittles others
• Compulsive lying

And specifically the type that also includes:

• High sensitivity to criticism
• Passive aggression
• A tendency to hold grudges
• A tendency to put themselves down (or make themselves seem like they're the victim)
• Grandiose fantasies
• Envy
• Self-serving ‘empathy’
• Feelings of inadequacy (that they take out on others)

 

Edited August 9, 2022 by Audra

2 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

I'd recommend including links to sources within the thread and on the internet. Paint a clear picture with data. 

yea, a index of issues with the pages involved listed would be a bare minimum. thread pages can be linked nicely enough, unless you want to really fine tune and use the post number for the actual starting point for any given thing.

then it just becomes a question on how detail oriented one might want it to be, what external links still exists related to the event, do you want to include the backstory explanations in the index, etc.

10 hours ago, LuluChan said:

Oh, no, I meant, where are all the people boycotting him? All the posts? Is it on another social media? Or is it that one single IG post? 

no, he has a buncha downloadable chibi mirai characters,  Eijii, Mirai, Chi, etc   with boycott smart doll.  his clever, if not man-child way of express how we thee entitled threaten to boycott smd    smh   wtf? i do not recall anybody sayin it shoes, but okay lolz

3 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

I worry we feed into his ego with all this. We've become the 'entitled' army he references in his tone deaf posts. What we say out loud here may actually injure him less at this point than complete silence would. Without people crying out in outrage at his antics he might start to feel like he doesn't exist. Influencers often seem to thrive on controversy, so take away the controversy and you take away a big chunk of his ability to enthrall his audience.

Yes. This.
It's not too far fetched that all this being-the-victim thing, or blowing things out of proportion, is to create drama to sell more products. Being nice hardly gets you acknowledged sells less.

I've started considering whether to go through this thread and do a series of posts on somewhere like tumblr (or somewhere better if people have thoughts) summarising the controversies. That way anyone can just get the highlights, and it can contain screenshots of sources etc.

It would be a big task, but probably needs doing.

I was happy when I finally found this place back when the whole BLM fiasco went down, and I was glad it was public. So I echo those who are in favor of keeping it public. It may or may not give DC ammo, but I think it's more important to understand the purpose of the thread itself. And I agree, I don't think anyone thought this nonsense would continue but...here we are.

It disturbs me to hear that he might have removed that whole "I'd rather starve" line after it was mentioned here (also the very idea. We already know money is the farthest from your mind, DC.) But it makes sense that he would come here or have an employee stalk the thread. Mainly, I just hate that anyone has to be banned simply for speaking their mind on DC's business practices. (I probably could have overlooked all of the other things if he hadn't made actively purchasing the dolls such a nightmare.) As long as the thread is serving the purpose of highlighting these "practices" and letting people talk about their personal experiences, then I think it should be left public. 

Wow I just read Danny's weird venting post, I thought Smartdoll had many standard skin tones but now I realize they only have 3. That's less than Volks had at some point, and equal to volks. I really thought they were more diverse! And yeah, Volks tan is nothing like Cocoa, but Cocoa could be better, it's weirdly shiny. Volks Tawny looks better imo. I also would like Danny, if he's reading, to understand that refusing a sale to a customer based on anything else than a legitimate reason (like security, or receiving downright insults from the customer) is a legal offense in some countries where he has some business. Yeah it's illegal to cancel an order because the customer wants to put a tee shirt on a rival company's doll.

 

Anyways, I wonder if Danny's taken criticism without getting weird and offended once in his life. Sometimes he reminds me of Yanderedev and his "too many emails" campaigns

 

About the recap thing, I'm not a stranger to gossip forums & videos (i know, sorry, lol) and a recap with screenshots and receipts of what he has done / might delete is always nice to put everything back in context and avoid being manipulated like he may be doing about the "too many cocoa dolls" thing!

Edited August 9, 2022 by AtelierMoe