The Facebook debacle & other issues

7 hours ago, DollyDearest said:

I was just mentioning that someone on x had comment how DC possibly profits from LGBTQIA themed dolls such as limitless ( infinity symbol) and wondered if it was bullying to make a 2 part video calling  out someone for having that opinion 

JSYK, Limitless is not an LGBT doll, she's a doll for autism awareness. I've made my thoughts on that doll known earlier in the thread. Also, as far as I'm concerned, Danny is a public figure, so I wouldn't call it bullying so much as having a discussion if the videos are made in good faith? No different than, say, pointing out Monster High's history with LGBT representation.

12 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

I'm guessing if there was a huge market for vinyl boys, then Volks would be making them a lot more often. Instead, they do more of an on-demand thing through Dream Choice and the occasional pre-order project.

5 hours ago, ladyandlion said:

I know that male dolls can be quite popular in the doll community. Smart Doll already offers so many diverse options, I don't think it's unreasonable to want or expect that (considering he had Eiji as his own original character and then later on Crimson.) But that's a really good observation. I suppose vinyl dolls are more anime-esque, may be harder to appreciate. Resin offers something more realistic. 

I think male dolls are actually hugely sought after. Look at how many people love that Imomodoll sells male bodies, or wish for Smartdoll's males to come back, or that the DDB and DDSB weren't Dream Choice exclusive. I mean, I would love if either of those things happen. I would say it's not entirely due to a lack of demand, but perhaps something else? Not saying it's something like sexism of course, but maybe Dollfie is unwilling to make the leap on selling male doll bodies outright in case they're not as popular as expected, as it would likely require more production costs.

 

 

Edited July 11, 2024 by PlasticJester
Wanted to respond to other people.

3 hours ago, PlasticJester said:

I think male dolls are actually hugely sought after. Look at how many people love that Imomodoll sells male bodies, or wish for Smartdoll's males to come back, or that the DDB and DDSB weren't Dream Choice exclusive. I mean, I would love if either of those things happen.

Are we talking dozens, hundreds, or thousands of people? Would the current demand for something scarce fall off if it wasn't scarce?

If they really had huge demand, I don't think they wouldn't lock it; I mean, if you can print money you do it. I'm sure they are aware of NA demand.

Volks USA should maybe think about adding male Icons to their Dollfie Icon lineup; if Japan will let them. They would be the very definition of "Boy Toy" 🤣😂🤣

Danny doesn't exactly need the money given that his likely inheritance will be staggeringly large, so he can make what he wants and ignore the market. 

It's hard to say with Volks because they like to do exclusive bodies like SD16, which iirc is normally limited to the America's, and unfortunately for North Americans boys are limited to Japan.

9 hours ago, ladyandlion said:

In previous pages of the thread, I believe it was mentioned that Danny might had been making some jokes and jabs at the male dolls and it was something like "I don't make them because I don't swing that way" or something similar. Please forgive me if I got that wrong or didn't do my due diligence in providing an example but it made me think of it 

You didn't get it wrong, that is back there in the thread. 

 

9 hours ago, ladyandlion said:

(and I'm not saying that makes Danny homophobic.) 

I am pretty sure his comment would be read as homophobic by most. 

15 hours ago, ladyandlion said:

I believe it was mentioned that Danny might had been making some jokes and jabs at the male dolls and it was something like "I don't make them because I don't swing that way" or something similar.

You can read up on it here

13 hours ago, PlasticJester said:

JSYK, Limitless is not an LGBT doll, she's a doll for autism awareness. I've made my thoughts on that doll known earlier in the thread. Also, as far as I'm concerned, Danny is a public figure, so I wouldn't call it bullying so much as having a discussion if the videos are made in good faith? No different than, say, pointing out Monster High's history with LGBT representation.

I think male dolls are actually hugely sought after. Look at how many people love that Imomodoll sells male bodies, or wish for Smartdoll's males to come back, or that the DDB and DDSB weren't Dream Choice exclusive. I mean, I would love if either of those things happen. I would say it's not entirely due to a lack of demand, but perhaps something else? Not saying it's something like sexism of course, but maybe Dollfie is unwilling to make the leap on selling male doll bodies outright in case they're not as popular as expected, as it would likely require more production costs.

 

Opps I ment like proud prowess, as I said making 2 by video's based on someone's beliefs is weird in of it's self 

 

14 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

I am pretty sure his comment would be read as homophobic by most. 

I think so too. I just didn't want anyone to think I was making accusations. Plus I wanted to be sure of what the original comment was.

"The most challenging part of making Eiji was that I have no interest in the male body what so ever - this made it difficult to decide what look smexy and what didn't. The female Smart Doll body however was dead easy as I kinda like the female form ^^"

Uhhh...okay. It's fine if he's not attracted to men but it's odd to even bring that up. Nor do I think it's required for him to constantly compare the male body to the girls. "He shares the same frame, he can wear their clothes. etc" Clearly he prioritizes the female dolls and that overall, dolls appeal more to women/girls in general and of course, male anime fans in this case. But I highly doubt the male artists and designers working at Vollks talk about or manufacture their male dolls with this mentality. They design male dolls for people who want them and it's not about trying to make them fit into the frame of the female dolls. You don't NEED to be attracted to men in order to create a male doll. If that were the case, would we have a bunch of GI Joes and ThreeZero figures? And I realize that male dolls fashioned after anime characters isn't quite the same as the super macho, hyper-realistic male figures that male collectors like to buy. So, he's trying to design the male dolls based on what women like. And sure maybe that's more challenging but I guess I'm not a fan of the weird mentality he's expressing. But I know that he clearly doesn't seem to want to do it, because he treats it like a school assignment that he's procrastinating on. He had them then suddenly decided to stopped creating them for some reason. 

To stay on topic, does he have to make male dolls in order to be supportive of Pride and the LGBTQ+ community? I guess that depends on what the customers think and what they want to see. Ultimately, these are dolls that you can project any kind of identity on to which is in the power of the customer to do that. But I get sick of people thinking Danny is this big-hearted person with a modest little start up business instead of the son of a millionaire who is just having fun with his little side project brand. I think he could actually make more money with his brand if he'd change up some of the things he's been doing but I don't pretend to be a business major. But here's the thing. When I go to the front page of the site, I don't see banners celebrating Pride with dolls holding Pride flags or being featured in same sex couplings or dolls being featured with their owners who happen to be SSA. What I do see is a bizarre amount of children, young children, posing with these dolls and NO actual adult doll owners. 

7 hours ago, Yumeiro said:

You can read up on it here

That was a very unpleasant, annoying read for me (*cringe*) but thanks so much for going to the trouble of finding the source. Much appreciated.

13 minutes ago, ladyandlion said:

When I go to the front page of the site, I don't see banners celebrating Pride with dolls holding Pride flags or being featured in same sex couplings or dolls being featured with their owners who happen to be SSA. What I do see is a bizarre amount of children, young children, posing with these dolls and NO actual adult doll owners.

...you know, you just brought up something I've never thought of. The bizarre child-based advertising has been discussed here time and time again. I'm personally not a fan of it, but that's not my main thought here. The thing is: where are all the photos of the diverse range of dolls with real human people like them? An amputee doll with an actual amputee, or a doll matched with a human with vitiligo, or even just the pear dolls with actual plus-sized people. And while, yes, you could claim that you can't track how many disabled people or people with matching features own these dolls...well, uh, that's where hiring models for advertising comes into play. I never realized how odd it is that I rarely even see, say, a black child with a black doll on-site.

2 hours ago, ladyandlion said:

But I highly doubt the male artists and designers working at Vollks talk about or manufacture their male dolls with this mentality. They design male dolls for people who want them and it's not about trying to make them fit into the frame of the female dolls. You don't NEED to be attracted to men in order to create a male doll.

The head of their Doll Design Department is a woman, and she has no issues working on male & female designs.  

On 7/10/2024 at 1:16 PM, DollyDearest said:

I was just mentioning that someone on x had comment how DC possibly profits from LGBTQIA themed dolls such as limitless ( infinity symbol) and wondered if it was bullying to make a 2 part video calling  out someone for having that opinion

I know the videos you're talking about and have watched them both in entirety, both creators are of the opinion that Danny is not pride profiteering. Whether or not you believe that is up to you, but those creators are extremely friendly to Danny and not bullying him at all. They offer some suggestions but really only because they want to see smart doll grow when that's not Danny's goal.

25 minutes ago, BeyondTime said:

The head of their Doll Design Department is a woman, and she has no issues working on male & female designs.  

Even better! 

4 hours ago, sunlightandtea said:

I know the videos you're talking about and have watched them both in entirety, both creators are of the opinion that Danny is not pride profiteering. Whether or not you believe that is up to you, but those creators are extremely friendly to Danny and not bullying him at all. They offer some suggestions but really only because they want to see smart doll grow when that's not Danny's goal.

I wasn't accusing. I just feel,it unnecessary to bring what people say on x every 5 mins. I empathize with people who feel strongly about something is all. I do apologize if I sounded dumb.

3 minutes ago, DollyDearest said:

I wasn't accusing. I just feel,it unnecessary to bring what people say on x every 5 mins. I empathize with people who feel strongly about something is all. I do apologize if I sounded dumb.

No I’m sorry! You don’t sound dumb at all, I just really like those creators and didn’t want their titles and thumbnails to be misconstrued. 

13 hours ago, ladyandlion said:

It's fine if he's not attracted to men but it's odd to even bring that up.

I sort of get it, from a creative standpoint. For example in terms of art, some'd rather draw women than men, animals rather than humans, cars rather than animals, and so on.
But he's not the one creating them, right?
So indeed! - If he doesn't want male dolls in his line of dolls, that's one thing. But if he wants them, but doesn't find them attractive... Danny, who cares about your no homo^^ tastes......

16 hours ago, sunlightandtea said:

No I’m sorry! You don’t sound dumb at all, I just really like those creators and didn’t want their titles and thumbnails to be misconstrued. 

thank you.

10 hours ago, Yumeiro said:

I sort of get it, from a creative standpoint. For example in terms of art, some'd rather draw women than men, animals rather than humans, cars rather than animals, and so on.
But he's not the one creating them, right?
So indeed! - If he doesn't want male dolls in his line of dolls, that's one thing. But if he wants them, but doesn't find them attractive... Danny, who cares about your no homo^^ tastes......

the question is why does sexuality play such a factor in making male gendered dolls?  just for  people to have options. the world isn't filled with just ladies.

Edited July 12, 2024 by DollyDearest

1 hour ago, DollyDearest said:

the question is why does sexuality play such a factor in making male gendered dolls?  just for  people to have options. the world isn't filled with just ladies.

I think for men there is a strong need not to be perceived as effeminate or emasculate; it can be a social death sentence.

6 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

I think for men there is a strong need not to be perceived as effeminate or emasculate; it can be a social death sentence.

I  agree. And it can lead to toxic masculinity.   I also feel Ken is being overshadowed by the pink lady. maybe am bias cause i feel  very little attraction to actual people. 

4 minutes ago, DollyDearest said:

I  agree. And it can lead to toxic masculinity.   I also feel Ken is being overshadowed by the pink lady. maybe am bias cause i feel  very little attraction to actual people. 

Maybe someday Eiji and Crimson will finally be Kenough for Danny 😔

10 hours ago, DollyDearest said:

I  agree. And it can lead to toxic masculinity.   I also feel Ken is being overshadowed by the pink lady. maybe am bias cause i feel  very little attraction to actual people. 

Not to get too tangent-y here, but you're right. Ken is inherently overshadowed by Barbie, but that's kind of always been the whole point of his existence in the doll line. He's the trophy husband arm candy for the woman that does and has it all. He's basically just a man-shaped purse for little girls to sacrifice to their dictatorship regimes be the dad in their games.

With SmartDoll, Danny likes to project his original characters onto every single release. In some ways, I can understand where he's coming from -- I rarely make (cis)male characters and it's even rarer still when one actually sticks around in my head for any significant length of time. I'm vastly more interested in telling stories about women and non-binary/transgender/genderqueer people.

On the flip side, even though SmartDoll is basically Danny's little vanity project to stick it to Volks or whatever, it's still a business. He could run it like basically every other doll company and give the sculpt a name, take a handful of pretty-ish pictures, and say "come get your man" without ever having to think more deeply about his lore. He could even make Eiji/Crimson/whatever boy to be Mirai's version of Ken and have him exist to be a glorified purse.

I appreciate what he's done in terms of expanding available body types and vinyl tones for this side of the hobby, but it's a strange business choice to both A) publicly acknowledge and B) straight ignore the demand for more boys.

41 minutes ago, Thespian said:

He could even make Eiji/Crimson/whatever boy to be Mirai's version of Ken

I don't think that fits with his concept of Mirai. 

18 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

I think for men there is a strong need not to be perceived as effeminate or emasculate; it can be a social death sentence.

It's really funny considering 'dolls' [in America mostly] are seen as a feminine item - something a girl would more likely to be interested in. That's the stigma, at least. So...since they are playing with dolls, does it really matter what sex the doll is meant to portray? 

IMO none of it matters at all. As someone who had to make a second account and use a friend's address to buy a Smart Doll that came with stains, the dolls are kinda mid. Cute, but still mid. And I didn't enjoy having to take a 'test' in order to purchase. Like, since I passed, where's my big discount? 

I've run a reptile selling business, so I have some insight on having to do 'what sells' or what my customers would prefer to see while also having it aligned with what I enjoy. Danny seems to expect people to buy his dolls and shut up. That's not how you run a business and I really don't know why people pander to him. Less sales = maybe he would hear his audience a little more. 

2 hours ago, Inolth said:

It's really funny considering 'dolls' [in America mostly] are seen as a feminine item - something a girl would more likely to be interested in. That's the stigma, at least. So...since they are playing with dolls, does it really matter what sex the doll is meant to portray? 

I mean in general men are expected to come across as masculine father-protector figures, and there is a lot of pressure to conform to that image. 

My comment was mostly about why Danny might have felt the need to signal his lack of interest in men and his great interest in women when discussing the process of designing Eiji. The comments in his post were unnecessary and not material to designing a product, but he felt the need to signal his straightness as he discussed working on the design for a male doll. I think men may feel compelled to do things like that as a part of maintaining their image as a man. 

I'm not trying to be critical here, I just think it's a reality of male existence.

Aaaaah, now I'm reminded of my essay class last semester. It was focused on gender issues, so I wrote all sorts of essays and research papers on these kinds of subjects. Forget it, I'm not doing it again! Though I will say there was a lot of talk about male-oriented dolls generally having huge, bulging muscles to perpetrate the idea that men must be BIG, MUSCLY, HULKING MASSES, and it is one of the things that have done a lot of damage over the years. It, along with many, many other things wrong with society and the patriarchy at large, has led to a theory called threatened masculinity, and honestly, I think Danny has this. Shh. And that may well be why he refuses to do much with male dolls again. It's a threat.

I'm not jumping in the drama, I'm just saying, we got a pear body for women so now we need a bear body for men.  Do it Danny, embrace the bear! 

30 minutes ago, DesertPhantom51 said:

I'm not jumping in the drama, I'm just saying, we got a pear body for women so now we need a bear body for men.  Do it Danny, embrace the bear! 

I’d like a body that would work for Gyomei Himejima, but it’ll probably be a cold day in Hell before bear bodies are made unfortunately. 😞

It's interesting how he's seen as very progressive and accepting when he's seemingly too insecure or disinterested to even make a male doll. Of course, it's his brand, it's his company, it's his product. He is not obligated to make male dolls if that's not the direction he wants for his brand, yet he seems to keep teasing the idea every couple of years. I can remember just getting into Smart Doll when Eiji and Crimson were available and they seemed popular enough at the time. I have no idea if that's changed. Perhaps the question of male dolls is neither here nor there but it was something that I thought was strange.

Overall, as I mentioned before, I find it stranger that he wants to sell Pride themed dolls but doesn't bother to advertise on the website (maybe he did for the month of June and I just missed that??? Honestly the "Pride Whiskers" are not even that noticeable to me.) Most of the images featured on the front page were kids and not adult doll owners (I'm not a business or marketing expert but I find these choices confusing. Based on the original question about whether Danny is profiting off of Pride, I tend to think so but that's only my personal opinion. Not everyone thinks or feels the same about Pride (though at times I feel like some people make excuses for brands just so they can still continue to buy their product without feeling guilty about what they could possibly be supporting.)

I will of course express my approval of Danny introducing darker skintones that are actually realistic and flattering as well as semi-real face sculpts (though they seem to have fully taken over from the overt anime styled heads which is a shame. I do prefer semi-real but there were a couple of anime faces I really liked and wanted for myself!) And it's nice seeing some plus size options introduced as well. But to me, I think the visual, physical representations of the dolls mean more than whatever they happen to stand for because ultimately, the owners can project what they like onto them.