The Facebook debacle & other issues

3 minutes ago, Deyja said:

No one here has taken a dig at him like that on this thread; we've just been discussing his business practices and the less than courteous things he's said on social media.

Yeah that's one of the reasons I really like this forum, people here tend to be really nice and are really respectful. I was just suprised at some of the stuff people where bringing up in that reddit thread, some of it was uncalled for. I can see why Danny would be a bit bitter ( although it doesn't excuse the things he does). 

11 minutes ago, Deyja said:

Whoa, I didn't even know that that reddit even existed. I'm reading through it and wowsers at some of the things said about Danny. Maybe that explains why he is overly hostile lately and not so much because of us and what we are saying (though I know he is reading it). I mean some of the comments made about his personal life and wife are really way below the belt. No one here has taken a dig at him like that on this thread; we've just been discussing his business practices and the less than courteous things he's said on social media.

I used to frequent a tumblr page called BJD Confessions where people anonymously confessed literally anything BJD related. Danny has a lot of enemies. Some of the things those people said about him, the Smartdolls and the fans was just brutal. 

I disagree with how Danny runs his business, his community, and his social media presence as a professional. But I don't think it does a damn bit of good to slag the man as a human being. He's made missteps and shown his ignorance, without a doubt. But... he's still a person, and it's clear that in spite of his professional missteps, the dude has Some Issues going on in some aspect of his life that have caused him to react so negatively to things, and I don't feel I, nor anyone else, have anything to gain for punching down at the man for who he is as a person like some of the commentators on that thread have. 

 

I get around the internet. I exist in many spaces and while I don't have much of a social media presence, I do read and see a lot. And I'll say that the folks over on /jp/'s bjd thread have been kinder to Danny than reddit were, even taking into account how uhhh... that website generally employs language. HobbyDrama can be pretty acerbic from what I've read, I think perhaps because many of us sort of "live here" as far as the hobby goes and are more familiar with Danny's behavior, we're... perhaps more willing to take a step back and try to understand why he's bristled against his customers? Whereas someone who doesn't go here would be more willing to pop the corn and wonder what's up with the angry doll man. I think at least on this forum, the overwhelming consensus is not condemnation, but a genuine desire to bring an end to the one-sided war of D. Choo vs. a Doll Forum. Speaking for myself, I would love nothing more than to be comfortable purchasing directly from the Culture Japan site and recommending the brand to my friends like I used to do in what feels like a lifetime ago. I don't... want to be enemies with anyone; I certainly don't want anything bad to happen to Smart Doll or Danny himself. More than anything I'd just like to be able to enjoy my dumb anime dolls in peace, but instead we're all here in the one place I know of where people are free to be honest about their experiences with Culture Japan and Smart Dolls, both positive and negative.

(Proof to point:
-Positive: they were willing to sell me replacement parts without proof of ownership when I asked the other day.
-Negative: In the middle of a photoshoot yesterday I had to reassemble my doll's whole elbow because it came apart through regular and expected use. I WAS JUST MOVING IT BACK TO A NEUTRAL POSITION. ALWAYS WITH THESE ELBOWS! AND IM NOT PAYING 200 dOLLARS FOR REPLACEMENTS.)

I always... try to remind people that in spite of the actions of Danny Choo himself, many people who own Smart Dolls don't condone his behavior. Many got them before he fully let his freak flag fly, many got them secondhand like me, and still others just enjoy the dolls and shouldn't have to feel guilty about that. But I think it's also good to remember that underneath the social media salvo and long-winded rants disguised as product descriptions, there's still a complex human being there and we don't have to absolve him of the impact and consequences of his actions to still take the time to understand that as a complex individual, he has the right to basic decency and to be treated with the same politeness we'd give one another.

tl;dr criticize product and professionalism, not people, is I guess my point. 

8 hours ago, Mothiraffe said:

 I think at least on this forum, the overwhelming consensus is not condemnation, but a genuine desire to bring an end to the one-sided war of D. Choo vs. a Doll Forum. Speaking for myself, I would love nothing more than to be comfortable purchasing directly from the Culture Japan site and recommending the brand to my friends like I used to do in what feels like a lifetime ago. I don't... want to be enemies with anyone; I certainly don't want anything bad to happen to Smart Doll or Danny himself.

Yeah, this is what gets me. o_o People are being polite and do want to enjoy smart dolls. Some people are expressing concern over how Danny is doing. It's hardly hostile. 😕 Maybe I'm being too charitable haha. But it being a "war" is odd. It makes me think of old foghorn leghorn cartoons... But instead of ignoring the chicken hawk, we're like "dude, is everything OK? We like dolls"

Have been in some internet wars that happened for no reason, and they were very surreal and drawn out. Please don't make a big deal out of this Danny (who is likely still reading). I want dolls, not wars!

I am reminded of something that came up in a Contrapoints video. She talks about how when people feel insecure/hate themselves, they go online looking for proof that their self-hatred is valid and rational. So they seek out haters and people who are saying negative things, and no amount of positive comments will make a dent. Because of course people are always honest when being horrible, but often dishonest when being nice (at least, in this psychological scenario). It's not even that things are black and white - they're just black. And it's unhealthy to keep seeking out negative reinforcement.

Danny, I think smart dolls are cute as hell and I want one so much. But I don't want the drama.

Edited June 12, 2020 by Katsudon

5 hours ago, Katsudon said:

Danny, I think smart dolls are cute as hell and I want one so much. But I don't want the drama.

Yeah
I was really rooting for Danny back when he just started selling Smartdolls. I'd like to root for him/them still. But finding a reason to do so now is almost nonexistent...

And about the reddit thread. You can dig up dirt on pretty much anyone - I'm sure most of us has done either cringy or creepy stuff in our younger days.
The important thing is if we've learned anything, or moved on from it.
So, a lot of the stuff said there is just irrelevant/not helping the situation.

@Katsudon

Quote

Contrapoints

Pretty sure I've seen that exact video, and that's a very insightful thought, I think- I think Danny goes looking for things that help him feel validated in "attacking first" to try and prevent any criticisms from happening in the first place- it's a sort of self-defensive behavior. "If I hurt myself first, then no one else can hurt me."

I am... very familiar with that mindset and it SUCKS to live like that. I still am... learning to even begin to deal with All of That and IF that is the case for our eye in the sky, I don't blame him for constantly feeling that he's under attack. When you live in that frame of mind, you CONSTANTLY tear yourself down, constantly try to make sure you never have even an iota of self-confidence or pride in yourself so that when you fail (because we all do, it's human nature,) you won't be destroyed by the disappointment and the shame. It's a brutal thing to do to yourself, and as a result even the gentlest correction  winds up feeling like an affront to the fact that you're even still alive. We might all say "hey. maybe don't liken your luxury product to a marginalized community. it's a bad look." But in that frame of mind it just feels like being publicly humiliated and like everyone in the world is watching it, too. Everyone you meet knows about that embarrassing thing you did in sixth grade and they're going to judge you by that one mistake until the day you die.

(I will say that whatever impetus he has for his actions, it certainly doesn't excuse the consequences of his behavior. The hurt he's caused is real. Our issues are an explanation, but they shouldn't be an excuse, at least not when we've hurt other people. To everyone here's that been brave enough to come forward with their experiences, I want to thank you -- because it's by speaking up that we got a fuller picture of the situation with Smart Dolls as a whole, even if the picture is not pretty. I just wish y'all hadn't had drama to dish in the first place. ;-; )

It's hellish. If that's something Mr. Choo's dealing with, I feel for him because it's really hard to come out of it, too. Obviously that's just all speculation, just... in real life, I'm a fretful person. It ruins my day if I so much as step on a slug. There are few people I want to see suffer on this earth, and Danny Choo isn't on that list. More than anything I'd just like... some kind of truce, or something. An acknowledgement that harm was done (not just about the most recent debacle, but towards his customers and community -- a simple "hey. i realize i fucked up. i want to apologize to xyz and anyone else i've hurt, and going forward here are the steps i will take to try and prevent this happening again." That's a hard thing to do, bare yourself like that, especially when you have a crowd of people around you that say DON'T APOLOGIZE YOU NEVER DID ANYTHING WRONG TO BEGIN WITH, but it's necessary, and I think it could help Danny himself move past all this, too. We forgive to free our own souls, and not to absolve those who hurt us of their actions. It's not sustainable to hyperfixate on the potential for being hurt to the point that you push everyone and everything that gives life meaning away. 

... Of course, as a semi-anonymous forum-goer who's never met the person in question, it's dubious that I have the right to speak on that sort of thing, too. I don't know the full situation of Danny's life, and I could be completely off-base! I certainly apologize if I have made any assumptions which offend, sincerely I do. 

I just wish we could move past this, but so many people here and elsewhere have been hurt. I want to be here like "BLUE! DOLL! I WANT THE BLUE!!!! DOLL!!!!!!!!!!" but instead I'm here, and we're all here, doing this instead. OTL

(I also want to yell about the blue doll. And all the other fantasy dolls. And Wondy and the other upcoming licensed characters and the semi-reals and Genesis...

...but then he keeps yelling at people for stupid stuff and I Am Tired.)

The blue doll has potential but I want to see those joints before I get hype about it at all.

And when will cinnamon joints match...

About half way down that reddit thread there is an interesting comment on wabi-sabi. 

NSFW: Profanity

https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/gsc4gc/anime_fashion_dolls_wabisabi_or_how_to_call/fs5h5y2/

Edited June 13, 2020 by BeyondTime

5 minutes ago, sunlightandtea said:

The blue doll has potential but I want to see those joints before I get hype about it at all.

And when will cinnamon joints match...

I do feel like he might be obscuring the joints on purpose...but also Dollfie Icon already has "fantasy skin + mismatched joints" as part of it's aesthetic, so I think he'd probably match the joints just to avoid comparisons (perceived competition with Volks aside).

 

11 hours ago, monkeypizzasonic said:

I do feel like he might be obscuring the joints on purpose...

His post says all they have made so far are the head, bust, and hands. Presumably every part hidden under the clothes is a different skin tone.

There has also been a suggestion that the blue skin might just be photoshopped.

Edit: I should have said "opinion expressed" and not "suggestion" here. Poor choice of words on my part.

Edited June 14, 2020 by BeyondTime

15 minutes ago, BeyondTime said:

His post says all they have made so far are the head, bust, and hands. Presumably every part hidden under the clothes is a different skin tone.

There has also been a suggestion that the blue skin might just be photoshopped.

Whoa where did that come from? I know there was speculation that he's trying to release the fantasy skins because Volks Idols are coming back, but to go as far as photoshopping and not actually putting out and item to compete is a very interesting strategy....

 

20 minutes ago, MaKayla_Panda said:

Whoa where did that come from?

You'd have to ask @Cauldroness for the historical details behind this.

Edited June 13, 2020 by BeyondTime

4 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

About half way down that reddit thread there is an interesting comment on wabi-sabi. 

NSFW: Profanity

https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/gsc4gc/anime_fashion_dolls_wabisabi_or_how_to_call/fs5h5y2/

This is a bit of a tangent... But have you/anyone here watched the show Rilakkuma and Kaoru? It doesn't say it explicitly, but it has a very wabi sabi philosophy. Kaoru loves the old apartment building she lives in because it has more character to her than new buildings. The sets are homely and a bit wonky. Paint on furniture is worn in a natural way from age and use. Kaoru even mentions Rilakkuma's kigurumi as an example - that it might be worn, but it is comfortable, and that makes it more precious.

Basically, if it wasn't for the drama over smart doll wabi sabi, I never would have noticed it in Rilakkuma and Kaoru XD

Sorry for the tangent. This has been on my mind a lot because of all the wabi sabi. 

45 minutes ago, Katsudon said:

It doesn't say it explicitly, but it has a very wabi sabi philosophy.

In concept I agree with wabi-sabi, and Danny's own example of the handmade tea cups vs. the machine made tea cups sells that concept well.

What that Reddit post seems to imply is that rather than a celebration of the wabi sabi ideal, what Danny is really doing is appropriating it in order to cover for manufacturing defects. That would not be an ok thing in my book. I don't think an English born businessman living in Japan, who makes products that embody the wabi sabi philosophy, is in and of itself cultural appropriation. Using wabi sabi as a label to excuse poor quality control would be cultural appropriation in my opinion.

With that said, that's just my own opinion, and the opinion expressed on Reddit could itself be incorrect. It's the internet, so take it all with a grain of salt.

Oh no, you're right. Wabi sabi is not really an excuse for defects in mass produced goods! There's a difference between character and poor quality control. I mean, no one wants a handmade tea cup that leaks out the bottom. XD

It does feel a bit appropriative. Pretty much for the reasons you say. I think it would be a difficult philosophy to reconcile with anything larger in scale than artisanal works. Which isn't really Danny's fault, beyond picking maybe not the most suitable aesthetic. Being inspired by it is fine, but using it as a shield doesn't work. 

Edited June 13, 2020 by Katsudon

8 minutes ago, Katsudon said:

Oh no, you're right. Wabi sabi is not really an excuse for defects in mass produced goods!

Oh I was pretty sure that part was correct. What I meant is that they could be incorrect about why he is doing it. They're making assumptions about his motivations, and while their opinion might be right, it might not be.

Edited June 13, 2020 by BeyondTime

So, for the red doll,  I don't remember if she was photoshopped or not. IIRC: Years ago, Danny showed a SmartDoll with a very vividly red skintone and indicated she would be an official release. Obviously that never happened. No visitor to the store has ever reported seeing the doll, and we've never seen non-Danny photos of her.

Somewhere around early Aug 2019, Danny showed girls in a vivid teal and green skin. On closer inspection, the photos had been clearly photoshopped -- the colors extended beyond the dolls, and bits of the background (that should have been a neutral brown) were also teal or green. Once again, these skin tones were never released. Note that was PERFECTLY timed with the announcement of Volks Icon only one month earlier, in July 2019. Interestingly, at the time he made a big deal of the dolls having "matching" joints (right when folks were surprised to hear that Icons had mis-matched joints) and he also made a big deal of announcing that he would "never" release dolls with mis-matched joints (lol whut cinnamon).

If you grab the full-size versions of these photos of the new blue dolls, they all show tell-tale signs of being photoshopped. The outlines around the hands are way too crisp in photos where the camera's focal point should have made them much softer and more blurred; on the pink girl, bits of her wig are colored the same blue as her skin where the color tool extended a little too far; on one of the photos of the head, there's a very slim line near the edge that the color tool didn't extend far enough and you can see the doll's actual skintone (milk); etc. Once again, this is PERFECTLY timed with the announcement that Volks Icon will be returning.

Just to be clear, I'm not open to debate on this topic. To me, the dolls are photoshopped, and I will firmly believe that up until the day I see actual owner photos (from an account wholly unrelated to Danny) and/or see one with my own eyes. Considering the history of the red, teal and green dolls, I suspect that day will occur about never.

 

Wasn't he reluctant to release fantasy skintones in the past? It's still there on his site that he will release green skin only when they discover life on Mars.

I agree with @Cauldroness about the timing of his fantasy skin announcements with the announcements of Dollfie Icon. Considering his childish spite towards anything Volks, somehow I'm not surprised.

Since people have been talking about wabi-sabi, I asked my boyfriend's perspective on it. He's a tea nerd and passionate about Japanese culture/traditions/history. I know this isn't directly related to everything being discussed here, but I think it's helpful to understand wabi-sabi and where it comes from. Hopefully it can help inform your opinions on the use of wabi-sabi. Here's what he had to say:

I’ll do my best do explain some of what I know about wabi-sabi. I’m not a scholar, so I’m sure there are some nuances that I’m missing, or better ways to think about things. If you do happen to be a scholar in this subject, feel free to help out and comment. 

 

Before the 15th century, the words “wabi” and “sabi” both existed in Japan, and were meditated on with a some regularity among aristocrats. They are notoriously difficult words to translate, but at this time they were linked to the ideas of suffering, withering, coldness, and loneliness. These words were focused on because in Zen Buddhism, suffering is tantamount to the human experience. To suffer, is to be human. To escape suffering is to achieve enlightenment. Buddhism was gaining popularity among aristocrats from the 13th century to the 15th century for a variety of reasons, and poets liked to write about buddhist concepts, which included the poetic ideas of both “wabi” and “sabi”.

 

Wabi-sabi started to become codified in the 15th century Japan by a man named Murata Jukō. When he was a young man, Juko noticed that tea parties of the time — called Tōcha — were boisterous and loud. Pretty much, they were where wealthy men went to gamble, party, and flaunt their tea knowledge. A modern-day equivalent might be wine and cheese night at your generic frat house. Juko found these Tōcha disgusting, and after studying zen buddhism and learning about more “polite” tea practice in Kyoto, he created a philosophy that would eventually be called wabi-cha. Wabi-cha would eventually turn into wabi-sabi. More on that later. But basically, wabi-cha favoured local, rustic Japanese earthenware pottery over the exquisitely delicate porcelain from China. Simplicity and austerity over elaborateness. More importantly, this simple, rustic aesthetic was tied inextricably to zen buddhism.

 

Juko passed wabi-cha down to Takeno Jōō who further developed the philosophical and aesthetic principles of wabi-cha. Eventually, it was eventually passed onto Sen no Rikyū, who is commonly understood as the father of cha-no-yu — the Japanese Tea Ceremony. 

 

Sen no Rikyū’s influence on wabi-sabi can’t be understated. He is, effectively, the one who brought wabi-sabi to Japan. Rikyū was the tea master of two of the most infamous war lords in Japanese history — Oda Nobunaga, and later Toyotomi Hideyoshi. Hideyoshi eventually ordered Sen no Rikyū’s to perform seppuku because Hideyoshi didn’t like Rikyū’s philosophy

 

The death of Rikyū is pretty important, I think, to the development of wabi-sabi. Effectively, Hideyoshi didn’t like wabi-cha, and disliked the ideas of simplicity, austerity, impermanence, suffering. Hideyoshi, later, put into effect the Tokugawa Class System — a formalized social structure that organized humans in various classes of people, and forced them to stay there by law. Hideyoshi once built an entire tearoom coated in gold, just to show off his opulence. Hideyoshi did not like wabi-sabi; Hideyoshi liked power and wealth. 

 

This historical context matters, because we can think of wabi-sabi as a sort of counterculture, that grew out of an opulent display of wealth. Wabi-sabi is buddhist. Wabi-sabi is an artistic expression of material items.

 

Wabi-sabi eventually grew into something that we now understand as “imperfect, impermanent, and incomplete”, and it’s been co-opted by tons of artists and designers. I personally think it’s a very misunderstood concept, because in order to understand wabi-sabi, we have to consider wabi-cha, the development and history of wabi-sabi, and the religious beliefs informing wabi-sabi. 

Here are a few examples of the wabi-wabi aesthetic, in a very traditional sense. Note that the examples are austere, almost introspective. Of course they are rustic and simple, as well:

 

https://imgur.com/a/7xXh6Og

 

All of this isn’t to gate keep what wabi-sabi is and isn’t. The term has evolved to encompass… almost anything “imperfect”, really. And I think when we make things too generalized, concepts lose their power, their true meaning. I personally think it’s worthwhile to keep in mind where the term comes from, and what it means to people who enjoy wabi-sabi in its original intent. 

So, Danny is lying once again about his dolls. Gee, what else is new?😒

@direpoodle Thanks much! Interesting read.

Edited June 15, 2020 by Selenae

@direpoodle That was a fascinating read, thank you!

@direpoodle that was super interesting! Very cool :3 thank you! 

Don't know if this could be of further use
I haven't watched the whole thing

I am not sure where to ask but I think this thread is perfect place,

back then someone told me why old mirai are discontinued and I also read it being mentioned somewhere on BJD confession tumblr recently that the first smartdoll sculptor/3D artist have meltdown with him,because not credited and he claimed it to be designed him personally, is there any link of such proof, maybe the sculptor/3D artist posted them on his/her social media ?

Edited June 17, 2020 by AyaToyBox
typos