Androgynous body

hey everyone! 

I'm currently contemplating trying to make one of my own characters into a vinyl doll. 

I only own an angelphilia at this moment. I love her so much but I am happy to branch out to other brands/sculpts. I am looking for a more androgynous looking body. The actual gender of the body isn't relevant as long as it has a flat chest (ish doesn't need to be perfect flat). The aim is for it to look genderfluid/androgynous underneath clothes. 

Any help or redirection to pages would be wonderful! 

I tried looking for this topic but I am still learning about this forum 😅

Thanks! 

PS if you have a doll like this feel free to add pictures! I love seeing other people's dolls.

 

Edit: I forgot to mention that I prefer something 50cm + somewhere around the 60cm would be perfect. 

Edited June 16, 2021 by The_Folktale_Fox

My first thoughts are parabox’s 50cm boy body (which uses obitsu base like AP but might be a little short since 50 is your min)

https://paraboxshop.jp/goods_en_jpy_3999.html

or a SS bust DD/DDS (more height, chest is not super pronounced especially under looser clothes, but more hip than a DDB/DDSB or male parabox) for a doll reference, miku has an SS bust

https://dollfie.ec.volks.co.jp/item/4518992407517.html

Of course, there is also DDB and DDSB but they are dream choice exclusive so to get these you’d have to either get lucky with buying second hand (Options are Kirito, Len, 9S or a used dream choice) or use a proxy to shop for you in Japan 

I’m pretty sure Miku was in her SS bust here (I have a M bust I swap her into from time to time but that’s large enough it should affect the jacket) and the left is a DDB - height difference is from the shoes.  
 

Edit: I don’t think there’s anything in Vinyl right now that actually hits 60cm since DD come in a bit shorter.  There used to be a male Obitsu 65 but they’ve discontinued those and tbh, I don’t think I’d classify the 65 body as androgynous as the ones above even if you managed to find one.  It’s unclear to me if there ever was an obitsu/parabox male 60cm, there was at least a 55cm, and regardless, both of those are also discontinued.  There’s also male smart dolls with a slim bust option v. a muscular one, but they are hard to track down as well. Edit 2: Actually, vindoll would be taller than 60, but yeah, not particularly androgynous and a very different aesthetic to other vinyls.

Edited June 16, 2021 by abs2891

@abs2891 thanks for the reply!

Yeah I saw the paradox boy body. I did wonder if it was 50cm without head or if that is with a head. if it's without, it might actually still work.

I like the way your miku looks.I'm still really learning about the Dolfie Dream side of the vinyl dolls. I think I still have a lot to learn. So I'll look up what you mentioned  Thanks again!

IMHO, the easiest way to get an androgynous body is to go with a flat chested Obitsu 50cm (either with boy chest or the smallest girl bust) or a DD/DDS with an SS bust.

The Obitsu 50cm body is supposed to be that height with the head, but will depend on which head is used. If it's important for your character to be taller than your AP girl, this may not work for you.

With a DD or DDS, keep in mind that they are taller but will appear to be in a different scale than your AP since the body and limbs are thicker and the head is much bigger. If you still want to go that route, you can do the girl body with the SS bust if you don't mind the hips, or of course you could hint for a boy body, but they're harder to come by.

In the same vein of a taller but thicker body would be the discontinued 55cm or 60cm Obitsu boy bodies. They will also appear to be a different scale than AP, and are also difficult to find due to no longer being in production. They used the older Obitsu joint system so weren't as popular. 

I personally wouldn't recommend using an Obitsu 65cm boy, a Smartdoll boy, or a Vindoll for an androgynous look, since those three bodies all read as masculine to me even when dressed. This is mostly due to wider shoulders, deeper chest, and/or more of a suggestion of an Adam's apple. A Smartdoll boy with the slim bust and arms could probably still pull off androgynous, but since the boys are only released sporadically via click war in the middle of the night, they can be even more difficult to obtain than a DD boy.

1 hour ago, Jezrah said:

IMHO, the easiest way to get an androgynous body is to go with a flat chested Obitsu 50cm (either with boy chest or the smallest girl bust) or a DD/DDS with an SS bust.

The Obitsu 50cm body is supposed to be that height with the head, but will depend on which head is used. If it's important for your character to be taller than your AP girl, this may not work for you.

With a DD or DDS, keep in mind that they are taller but will appear to be in a different scale than your AP since the body and limbs are thicker and the head is much bigger. If you still want to go that route, you can do the girl body with the SS bust if you don't mind the hips, or of course you could hint for a boy body, but they're harder to come by.

In the same vein of a taller but thicker body would be the discontinued 55cm or 60cm Obitsu boy bodies. They will also appear to be a different scale than AP, and are also difficult to find due to no longer being in production. They used the older Obitsu joint system so weren't as popular. 

I personally wouldn't recommend using an Obitsu 65cm boy, a Smartdoll boy, or a Vindoll for an androgynous look, since those three bodies all read as masculine to me even when dressed. This is mostly due to wider shoulders, deeper chest, and/or more of a suggestion of an Adam's apple. A Smartdoll boy with the slim bust and arms could probably still pull off androgynous, but since the boys are only released sporadically via click war in the middle of the night, they can be even more difficult to obtain than a DD boy.

Thank you so much! This is very helpful. The character is supposed to be taller than my AP girl which is why I'm kind of hung up on the idea. 

Smartdoll might work, that's a good suggestion. 

Though I enjoy the look of the vindoll and may end up getting one eventually. I don't think he'd be good for the character I have in mind. 

I think my best bet would probably be the DD with an SS bust. 

Just for your information, there is NOW a Obitsu50 S bust (Whitey) on mandarake for 800 yen:

 

https://order.mandarake.co.jp/order/detailPage/item?itemCode=1168590084&ref=list&dispCount=240&categoryCode=020114

38 minutes ago, Testament said:

Just for your information, there is NOW a Obitsu50 S bust (Whitey) on mandarake for 800 yen:

 

https://order.mandarake.co.jp/order/detailPage/item?itemCode=1168590084&ref=list&dispCount=240&categoryCode=020114

Thanks for the tip! I just don't think I can commit just yet 😅

The 50cm Obitsu/Parabox boy is very androgynous-looking and would probably look the most natural next to an AngelPhilia doll.  If you get one of the male bust pieces, you may be able to fit it on a DDS/DD body; according to the bust fitment guide pinned at the top of this forum, other busts for the 50cm Obitsu body do fit the DDS/DD.  However, the male bust has an odd cut to the bottom that may make it not work.

The 55cm Obitsu boy would also work pretty well, but it's no longer available, unfortunately.

If you're okay with resin options, the Doll Family-H 56cm boy is quite androgynous.

Edited June 27, 2021 by Tira

4 hours ago, Tira said:

The 50cm Obitsu/Parabox boy is very androgynous-looking and would probably look the most natural next to an AngelPhilia doll.  If you get one of the male bust pieces, you may be able to fit it on a DDS/DD body; according to the bust fitment guide pinned at the top of this forum, other busts for the 50cm Obitsu body do fit the DDS/DD.  However, the male bust has an odd cut to the bottom that may make it not work.

The 55cm Obitsu boy would also work pretty well, but it's no longer available, unfortunately.

If you're okay with resin options, the Doll Family-H 56cm boy is quite androgynous.

That's a great suggestion! thanks

Here is a picture of my male Obitsu 65cm next to my 50cm and 60cm dolls for comparison. This picture was taken a few months ago. Meigana (50cm) has new and bigger boobs while the other two have new eyes.

Edited June 29, 2021 by Rneiro

Here is an image from his Mandarake product description. 16mm eyes. I’m not sure what his wig size is, but it’s bigger than 8.5 for sure!

Awawawawawawawawawawawawa

Sorry for the multiple messages on here. I found him for sale on Mandarake for 12k JPY. Yes, Obitsu(s) over 50cm were discontinued long ago and new replacement parts will not be available in the future unless you find it new or used elsewhere.

I want to hybrid 2 60cm and taller dolls’ frames with Dollfie Dream f3 parts. The 65cm frame especially is very rigid and unforgiving. I also was thinking about getting a flatter AP bust for a male doll. I’m not sure how tall or short I want my DIY male doll to be.. Notebook time!

If you go on the DollyPop website, they are selling a 50cm SS bust that can go along with their bottom and torso pieces. I read that they do not plan on releasing male bottom parts in the future. However, the product post was from 2015 or 2016, so they could’ve changed their minds..

I wonder if Obitsu will bring back dolls over 50cm in the future. Should I ask about that??

That old body looks really good... ugh I only wish.. I am not very well versed yet in mandarake and such to dare to buy anything just yet. Just going to hope that they will come out with another taller boy body in future. 

I really like the bigger Obitsu boy bodies- at least the vinyl parts I mean. The frame could use a workover but I wish they'd done that instead of just discontinuing them.

Sneaking into this thread to add my new doll - combined a flatter bust with the muscular b-type arms and legs to make an androgynous/trans Angel Philia and I'm pretty happy with the result! (Now I just need to make a tan version to match the Genesis head...)

15 hours ago, The_Folktale_Fox said:

That old body looks really good... ugh I only wish.. I am not very well versed yet in mandarake and such to dare to buy anything just yet. Just going to hope that they will come out with another taller boy body in future. 

This male body along with 2 barrettes was my first Mandarake purchase. I jumped and purchased him as soon as I set eyes on him.

11 hours ago, Jezrah said:

I really like the bigger Obitsu boy bodies- at least the vinyl parts I mean. The frame could use a workover but I wish they'd done that instead of just discontinuing them.

Me too.. There aren’t a lot of vinyl BJD makers that release affordable male bodies in abundance. There are Dollfie Dream Boy (DDB) and Dollfie Dream Sister Boy (DDSB) bodies, but those are Doll Point exclusives (in-store IN Japan) and are stupid expensive. They sell for 68,000 JPY rounded up. 
 

Parabox sells their own male bodies using the Obitsu frame, but they range from 40cm to 50cm for 22k JPY each and sell for 30k JPY as Custom Basic Sets.
 

A Parabox Custom Basic Set is both the doll body with an available head with a faceup of your choice for 30k JPY. Also, faceup heads for custom basic sets are given priority over individual (without a body) faceup heads. I want to purchase a Parabox boy custom basic set in the future.
 

My only issue with those boy bodies is that they are too childlike and not muscular or sculpted like my male 65cm. That’s what they’re called boy bodies and not men bodies, I guess!

Edited July 1, 2021 by Rneiro

This conversation makes me wonder: there are no third party companies that sell ankle risers to increase the height of a doll like they have, most notably for action figures, but also (although I don’t own one so I can’t say for 100% certainty) for Loongsoul 70-80cm male bodies? You’d think this would be popular