The price of Dollfie Dreams

Excuse me arrex, but apparently you didn't read my original post. Where did I say that Dollfie Dreams should be in the $20-100 range like a Barbie doll? Nowhere, all I was trying to say, was that I believe Volks over prices their ORIGINAL designs. I was not (typing this for the third time now) talking about the limited or licensed DDs or when they get on the secondary market. But after all is said in done, these are all only our opinions and everyone's will differ.

 

I did read your post and I was using the extended price comparison between a Volks and Barbie and a generic handbag and Prada or Louis Vuitton. I never said that Volks should be the same price as a Barbie.

 

I do not believe Volks overprice at all.

My main thrust is that the total market is actually smaller than a lot of people imagine, that the actual volumes produced are small, that Volks is a small (relatively) company producing small numbers for a niche market and that costs to produce therefore are much higher as a consequence and you should be prepared to pay a premium for a premium product.

The only time I get cross with Volks is when the quality of what I receive is substandard to what I believe to be acceptable - and it is small details eg - Saber Lily's ponytail detaching.

The only time I get cross with Volks is when the quality of what I receive is substandard to what I believe to be acceptable - and it is small details eg - Saber Lily's ponytail detaching.

 

The ponytail problem really boiled my blood - most of the wigs I've encountered from Volks have been of what I'd consider to be an atrocious quality and brutally over priced for the quality.

That's really a shame about Saber Lily's wig! Good thing it's a simple fix, though.

That's really a shame about Saber Lily's wig! Good thing it's a simple fix, though.

 

I wouldn't really say it's a simple fix... The wig pretty much starts to ruin itself before you can even get it out of the netting!

Wow, that sounds pretty bad. Anyone have pics of the wig? (Saber Lily is actually on my wish list)

Wow, that sounds pretty bad. Anyone have pics of the wig? (Saber Lily is actually on my wish list)

 

There are some really nice shots on Wolfheinrich's site showing the process he used to strengthen his Lily's wig:

 

http://www.wolfheinrich.com/2011/01/20/dollfie-dream-dd-saber-lily-wig-instrumentality-project/

 

I was very worried when I got Lily and took extra care of it but it seems I got lucky and had one of the stronger wigs. I let Lily wear it for a few months before she changed to another wig. I was still careful with the wig but I did mover her around when wearing it:

 

 

I think it's a matter of luck, being careful, and taking preventive measures if you are still uncomfortable. Not that you should have these worries with a $1100 DD. (or any DD!)

 

**James.

Eh, all the theories and interesting ideas aside, (I love the topic btw) I like collecting Volks because it's Volks. I really love their ideas, heritage and the business. I like how much they bring to the idea of doll collecting and how important their dolls are. I love the idea of what makes a Volks doll a Volks doll. Does that make it better or worse than anything else? Not really. It's just different for me, personally, as a collector.

 

DDs are a little different because I really do love anime and watch a ton of it. If I want a DD, I really want to watch the material associated with her so I know the ideas that govern her appearance and her creation. It makes the character more 'real' to me. I think Volks makes some really amazingly, lovely, inspired anime dolls of a quality I've not seen elsewhere. Hey, I'd love it if another company made super awesome high quality dolls for less money but until there's real competition in that realm (vinyl anime inspired) then I am not really going to look elsewhere.

 

I also love that you can design your own dolls. I think it makes the hobby fun, accessible and creative for people who wouldn't ordinarliy be able to afford an LE.

 

Sometimes I think it is because of the price and how difficult they are to get (not necessarily the sum total value of the materials) that imparts exclusivity and value.

 

Yes, sometimes things can be stupidly expensive but that's what makes it limited and exciting. I think if everything was always available then I wouldn't be as interested in the brand. I love seeing what unique items people have and what they turn them into- it's this massive, expensive, wonderful commitment to a hobby.

 

It also makes a pretty tight community because anyone willing to buy in and collect these dolls has kind of crossed a barrier... has sought about the product and usually competed to own it. It's kind of a big stinking deal that involves a lot of waiting and international post.

 

The hunt is part of the joy, yes?

 

*^^*

 

Great, great topic.

 

Now staining.... DON'T GET ME STARTED ON STAINING. Speaking of.... hmmmm....

I personally have nothing against how much Dollfie Dreams cost, given how nice they are. If anything it makes them more interesting to collect. There has to be a high end of the market somewhere, from small figures all the way up to DD.

As an individual who has done a great deal of research into not only the variety of vinyl dolls, but also the realm of resins, I can say Dollfie Dreams have always had a special calling to me. Their bodies are very well made and aesthetically pleasing, when dealing with resin dolls, the look of a body can be a deal breaker.

 

I admit, I have never really particularly cared for any of Volks' resin dolls, they've just always looked a bit odd to me, and their bodies a bit too chunky for my tastes (For anyone familiar with resins, I own 3 RingDoll Teen boys, well known for being slim bishie-like sorts.) However, I had always contemplated Dollfie Dreams, specifically the option heads, because I do love being able to create my own characters. Being an anime fan, there's also just something exciting about being able to have your own 1/3 scale anime girl around.

 

I have done a great deal of research, and actually for a body with a blank head and shipping, a Volks DD is around $290, while an Obitsu of the same size is around $308. Dollfie Dreams are actually cheaper than Obitsu of the same size, and in my opinion have a much more pleasing body aesthetic. Now, I am sure there are those who would disagree with me, and that's completely fine, but in the world of resin, any dolls 58-63cm under $300 is considered an amazing deal, so honestly, I don't see why there are such complaints about price with them. The blank DDs are really quite affordable.

One important aspect to keep in mind is that selling them for a higher price and in limited quantities makes them special. Not everyone can have them, and they are worth something. This really helps turn them into a collector's item, and increases their brand recognition.

I have such a love/hate thing going on with this topic. Sometimes I hate I even put this up beause it makes me want to argue so much, but other times I tell myself it's what I wanted, honest opinions from people. When I first wrote this I was really talking about the cost of the regular bodies and heads and the prices of official Volks dolls (not licensed dolls) when they're first released. They used to be much cheaper and over the last few years I've felt that Volks was just trying to beat us collectors. But Volks is a business like any other and if we collectors continue to buy their products they just may continue to raise the prices to whatever they want. This is definitely happening with another doll I collect. They aren't DDs but their prices have increased dramatically over the past 2-3 years even without the bad exchange rates.

I have such a love/hate thing going on with this topic. Sometimes I hate I even put this up beause it makes me want to argue so much, but other times I tell myself it's what I wanted, honest opinions from people. When I first wrote this I was really talking about the cost of the regular bodies and heads and the prices of official Volks dolls (not licensed dolls) when they're first released. They used to be much cheaper and over the last few years I've felt that Volks was just trying to beat us collectors. But Volks is a business like any other and if we collectors continue to buy their products they just may continue to raise the prices to whatever they want. This is definitely happening with another doll I collect. They aren't DDs but their prices have increased dramatically over the past 2-3 years even without the bad exchange rates.

I think the sudden jump in the overall demand for Volks' Dollfie Dream® is the cause of the high price increase. Volks, Inc. probably couldn't keep up with the demand in term supply, so they just increased the price on their products instead. As long as Volks keep getting a sell-out for everything they released, I don't see why they would want to decrease the price. If I'm in Volks' position, I would actually increase production (to raise supply) and raise the price tag. It would make perfect sense... since consumers are willing to take everything that "I" released.

 

I'm interested to see what Volks is going to cook up for the girls in White Album 2. White Album 1 female lead character's, Yuki Morikawa's, price tag soared over 300% in just a week. If the staff at Volks didn't notice that huge spike in her price, I wouldn't know what to say to them. Chances are, we may be seeing the White Album 2 girls sometime next year. Well, it's only an inductive speculation that I have. There's no solid proof behind the claims that I made.

 

Update 1:

Changed 'White Album girls' into 'White Album 2 girls'.

Edited September 10, 2011 by Guest

White Album 1 female lead character's, Yuki Morikawa's, price tag soared over 300% in just a week. If the staff at Volks didn't notice that huge spike in her price, I wouldn't know what to say to them. Chances are, we may be seeing the White Album girls sometime next year. Well, it's only an inductive speculation that I have. There's no solid proof behind the claims that I made.

 

The White Album Dollfies were both preorder projects - in other words that everyone who wanted Rina and Yuki and preordered got one. So there is absolutely no issue on the initial production numbers of these 2 dollfies.

Not only that unlike Touhou preorder project the White Album preorder project was an international one.

The reason for the price spike was that AFTER release people realized that they wanted them. (ie changed their mind)

I am working off the premise that the vast majority of who preordered it - ordered to keep them, They would not ordinarily onsell. So the price spike is due to late comers having to offer much higher amounts to the original owners who intended to keep them to part with them.

Unlike other releases where some people will buy to resell later there was very little incentive in the case of the White Album Dollfies - since if you did want one and preordered you got one.

And there is a lesson in DD collecting - Dont sit on the fence and regret it later.

White Album 1 female lead character's' date=' Yuki Morikawa's, price tag soared over 300% in just a week. If the staff at Volks didn't notice that huge spike in her price, I wouldn't know what to say to them. Chances are, we may be seeing the White Album girls sometime next year. Well, it's only an inductive speculation that I have. There's no solid proof behind the claims that I made.[/quote']

 

The White Album Dollfies were both preorder projects - in other words that everyone who wanted Rina and Yuki and preordered got one. So there is absolutely no issue on the initial production numbers of these 2 dollfies.

Not only that unlike Touhou preorder project the White Album preorder project was an international one.

The reason for the price spike was that AFTER release people realized that they wanted them. (ie changed their mind)

I am working off the premise that the vast majority of who preordered it - ordered to keep them, They would not ordinarily onsell. So the price spike is due to late comers having to offer much higher amounts to the original owners who intended to keep them to part with them.

Unlike other releases where some people will buy to resell later there was very little incentive in the case of the White Album Dollfies - since if you did want one and preordered you got one.

And there is a lesson in DD collecting - Dont sit on the fence and regret it later.

Pre-order Projects: Does pre-ordering a Dollfie Dream® from a project like the White Album Project guaranteed a successful transaction? If the pre-order deadline is tomorrow at 12:00 PM and 2,000 people filled out the pre-order form, would ALL these individuals receive what they ordered for? Is there a limit to how many "pre-order" Dollfie Dream® Volks, Inc. can produce for a single project? Is Yuki Morikawa a "Limited Edition" Dollfie Dream®? What is 'Limited Edition'?

 

Assuming that the following premises are true:

Premise 1: Volks, Inc. can guaranteed everyone's pre-order made before the project's pre-order deadline. [True]

Premise 2: Yuki Morikawa is a Limited Edition Dollfie Dream® available for pre-order. [True]

 

Therefore:

-Everyone that pre-ordered a Yuki Morikawa before the pre-order deadline will receive a Limited Edition Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa. [True]

 

A spike in price is natural for most limited edition items in the after-market, especially popular brands like Dollfie Dream® and Super Dollfie®. Limited Edition Dollfie Dream® like Saber, Tamaki, Sasara, and Yuki Morikawa are more expensive in the after-market. However, why is it that the price tag, or price equilibrium, for Yuki Morikawa soared over 300% (with respect to the retail price) within just a week?

 

Sellers are in Group A, and buyers are in Group B.

First of all, Group A is not competing against Group B, or vice-versa. Sellers have little to no power in controlling the end price of the auctions that they put up. The only tool that they have at their command is the ability to set a reserve price (as a form of protection against low ballers). For Buy-it-now listing, the price a seller set is the value that seller is willing to sell for. If the buyer's value doesn't reach the seller's value for that respective price in that particular listing, then the transaction between those two individuals would not be conducted - there's no competition between them.

 

Keep in mind that the high "Buy-it-now" prices that you see for the Limited Edition Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa were the direct results of Yuki Morikawa auctions increasingly ending in high value/price.

 

[You don't have to read this; it's only for reference] Competition between a seller and a buyer occurs only when both parties bargained with each other. Nevertheless, this type of "competition" doesn't affect the price equilibrium of the market. For instance, if the buyer is better at bargaining, then he/she gets more out of the trade. However, if the seller is the one who's better at bargaining, then he/she gets more out of the trade. This type of competition will not raise the price equilibrium of the market.

 

True Competition

The people in Group A complete amongst themselves, and the individuals in Group B compete amongst themselves. When sellers compete against each other, the price goes down. And, when buyers compete against each other, the price goes up.

 

What I don't understand is the correlation between an increase in the equilibrium price of Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa to the assertion that the spike in price was caused by sellers setting their prices high for buyers.

 

Dollfie Dream® Rina Ogata = White Album Dollfie Dream®

Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa = White Album Dollfie Dream®

Dollfie Dream® Rina Ogata & Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa

Therefore, White Album Dollfie Dream® = Dollfie Dream® Rina Ogata & Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa

 

arrex-san asserted that "the price spike is due to late comers having to offer much higher amounts to the original owners who intended to keep them to part with them." In other words, the price spike was caused by sellers setting their prices high for buyers (please correct me if I'm wrong). The first premise that was provided claimed that "the vast majority of who preordered it - ordered to keep them," and the second premise, which follows the first premise, stated that "[The White Album Dollfie Dream®] would not ordinarily [on sale]." In other words, the White Album Dollfie Dream® were not ordinarily on sale because the people that pre-ordered the White Album Dollfie Dream® ordered them to keep them. And, the last premise that was provided stated that "Unlike other releases where some people will buy to resell later there was very little incentive in the case of the White Album Dollfies." In other words, there was very little incentive for swing traders to buy the White Album Dollfie Dream® just for the sole purpose of reselling them in the near future.

 

Premise:

-The White Album Dollfie Dream® were not ordinarily on sale because the people that pre-ordered the White Album Dollfie Dream® ordered them to keep them. [True]

-There was very little incentive for swing traders to buy the White Album Dollfie Dream® just for the sole purpose of reselling them in the near future. [True]

Therefore:

The price spike was caused by sellers setting their prices high for buyers. [False]

 

The direct cause for the high increase in price was caused by a sudden high demand for a low and limited supply.

 

 

[Reference]

 

Modus Ponens

"[if] you did want one and preordered you got one." In other words, if you pre-ordered a White Album Dollfie Dream®, you would get one.

 

1. If A, then B. [Assertion]

2. A. [Premise]

3. Therefore, B. [Conclusion]

 

1. If you pre-ordered a White Album Dollfie Dream®, then you would get one. [Assertion]

2. You pre-ordered a White Album Dollfie Dream®. [Premise]

3. Therefore, you get a White Album Dollfie Dream®. [Conclusion]

Thats a long exposition.

 

Not only that there were 2 preorder periods for the White Album DDs. The preorder period was left open for weeks not even a single day.

Everyone who preordered during the first offer period was guaranteed a White Album DD plus got a free swimsuit. Everyone who ordered during the 2nd period was also able to get one (minus the swimsuit)

Volks only released limited pictures during the first preorder period.

 

So the only reason you would have missed out was:

1. You didnt know about DDs at the time and later tried to acquire one

2. You sat on the fence like Danny Choo and then broke and acquired one.

3. You were broke at the time.

Thats a long exposition.

 

Not only that there were 2 preorder periods for the White Album DDs. The preorder period was left open for weeks not even a single day.

Everyone who preordered during the first offer period was guaranteed a White Album DD plus got a free swimsuit. Everyone who ordered during the 2nd period was also able to get one (minus the swimsuit)

Volks only released limited pictures during the first preorder period.

 

So the only reason you would have missed out was:

1. You didnt know about DDs at the time and later tried to acquire one

2. You sat on the fence like Danny Choo and then broke and acquired one.

3. You were broke at the time.

Yes, it was a long piece, and I can't help it. I tend to give a "back story" whenever I backtracked to explain something. I don't find it annoying, and would be happy to give back stories at all time. ^.^;

 

Yes, I am one of those unfortunate people that didn't know about Dollfie Dream® at the time. Although I'm a swing trader, I would NOT be reselling Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa IF I get my hands on her. She's a keeper.

 

I LOVE customs. If I receive a Yuki Morikawa, I would give her a new face-up with eyelashes.

 

I DIG the ongoing prices for Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa. Those prices are going to keep her up for awhile (hopefully until I get my financial situation on track - fingers crossed~).

 

It was nice talking to you, arrex-san. I appreciate the intelligent conversation that we are having/had. If you would like to continue the conversation or talk about other things in our life, I just want to let you know that I'm interested and opened for further exchanges.

 

You sat on the fence like Danny Choo[/b][/color] and then broke and acquired one.

I am not sure to whether or not Danny Choo ever got to the fence, but I find your comment to be very amusing. Danny sure paid quite an over-marked price for his Yuki Morikawa, and I will be in the same boat as him in the near future. Now if you would excuse me, I would like to dig into this bowl of noodles. XD

I DIG the ongoing prices for Dollfie Dream® Yuki Morikawa. Those prices are going to keep her up for awhile (hopefully until I get my financial situation on track - fingers crossed~).

 

And the other reason that people were meh on the White Album Dollfies to start was that the anime apparently sucked.

I know Fate Stay anime had a lot of detractors as well but I think the game was also more popular than White Album

Hence there was less enthusiasm for the White Album DDs as character DDs. However as their designs are amongst the better DDs released, people changed their mind later. I actually preordered a Rina based on her design then got put off after i watched the anime. I then transfered my preorder to a friend before I took delivery of her - he had changed his mind about acquiring her mainly because I think he got the original eroge.

Thats a long exposition.

 

Hahahah~ Usually by the time people start writing forum posts that long they are either cheesed off and telling someone off or just stroking their ego. It's nice to see all of this ended happily and in a friendly manner. That is exactly why I love this forum- I was worried over nothing!

 

Who knew dear Yuki could inspire such impressive posts. She is the 'Helen of Troy' for dollies. As long as the quality is there for DDs then I have no problem paying for them. Look at the other darling Azone and Mama Chapp dolls. I love them so very much but they don't seem to be of the same quality as the Volks products and they cost 1/2 to 2/3 as much! Usually I just revert back to saving for my next DD/outfits/accessories when I look at the prices for some of these dolls.

 

(I could be totally wrong about the quality so if you own these gorgeous girls, please chime in!)

 

I'm still willing to pay more for Volks but if they don't solve the staining problem.... well, that may change.

...

 

I'm still willing to pay more for Volks but if they don't solve the staining problem.... well, that may change.

 

I don't think it's something that can be solved. The only way to stop the staining would be to stop making them out of vinyl, and then they wouldn't be DDs anymore.

I'm still willing to pay more for Volks but if they don't solve the staining problem.... well, that may change.

 

I don't think it's something that can be solved. The only way to stop the staining would be to stop making them out of vinyl, and then they wouldn't be DDs anymore.

 

 

Oh, it could be solved easily if the people in R&D and QC would get off their butts and quit letting clothing reach the shelves *THAT STAIN*. Volks makes some of the best clothing out there and half of it will destroy their DD's within minutes. The newest release of the Saber Maid set literally left *BAD* stains after *FIVE MINUTES* of being on the doll. *THAT* to me is inexcusable.

 

You can't sit there and tell me that someone just happened to miss this fact when they were testing the fitment of these clothes on a DD or when the stock photos for the promotion were taken. The only way that's possible is if the prototype clothing was made from different materials altogether and then changed later to save a buck. I can totally see that happening.

 

I understand Volks needs to make money and I also understand that some fabrics are cheaper than others. But when you charge people $142 USD for an outfit that is for a specific character doll that cost well over $1200 USD and it stains within five minutes, that's pure laziness and cashing in on your good name. I know Volks has that disclaimer on their clothing... it's on all of it. You'd think the parent company of a product would go a little extra step to make sure it's expensive products don't destroy other products of theirs that are even more expensive.

 

<>

 

 

Sorry for all that but this is one thing that Volks does that totally cheeses me off. I love me some Volks and I love thier products. I just hate that I can't 100% trust them to be looking out for me or anyone else with some of their products.

 

 

Billy

I just hate that I can't 100% trust them to be looking out for me or anyone else with some of their products.

 

... especially with the prices you are paying for brand spanking new items. That's my issue with the whole thin! They have such quality products and then it's like a giant 'face palm' on the staining issue. Plenty of vinyl is available that doesn't stain- look at prosthetics and items that (for practical, utilitarian purposes) cannot be allowed to stain that easily.

 

I'm guessing it is a matter of expense, materials and profit margin. It would be an improvement if the stains were more easily removed or it was less prone to permanent bruise marks. Instead of owning the flaw Volks was posting: "WE DO NOT CONSIDER STAINING A DEFECT." It sure as hell is a defect- whether they want to recognize it or not.

 

Of course you can always give Volks another 250.00 and just replace the body. It's kind of a win-win-win-win-win for them. They are, after all, a business. Sigh. 95% awesome, 5% @#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#.

 

..................

 

 

/soapbox

 

No need to apologize, Billy. You and I feel the same way with close to the same intensity.

I don't think it's something that can be solved. The only way to stop the staining would be to stop making them out of vinyl, and then they wouldn't be DDs anymore.

 

Early on there were a few "DD"'s in resin....

Although they were called "Super Dollfie Dream".

http://www.volks.co.jp/jp/event/dolpa11/lot02.aspx

http://www.volks.co.jp/en/event/dollsparty13/dolpa13_auction.aspx

http://www.volks.co.jp/jp/event/dolpa13/lot02.aspx

 

Whilst this would result in loss of poseability I wouldnt mind a resin option with new releases.

Whilst this would result in loss of poseability I wouldnt mind a resin option with new releases.

 

But then with resin you'd have to deal with the fact that it will yellow slightly with time (which is an inherent problem with all resin dolls, Volks or not). You lose one "problem" to have it replaced with another...

But then with resin you'd have to deal with the fact that it will yellow slightly with time (which is an inherent problem with all resin dolls, Volks or not). You lose one "problem" to have it replaced with another...

 

I own resin dolls as well and their mild yellowing is no real issue.

Not compared to nasty slather the DD in remove zit for 7 days stains.... As I said it would be nice to have the option to take the DDs either as vinyl OR resin.

Early on there were a few "DD"'s in resin....

Although they were called "Super Dollfie Dream".

http://www.volks.co.jp/jp/event/dolpa11/lot02.aspx

http://www.volks.co.jp/en/event/dollsparty13/dolpa13_auction.aspx

http://www.volks.co.jp/jp/event/dolpa13/lot02.aspx

 

Whilst this would result in loss of poseability I wouldnt mind a resin option with new releases.

 

That first one looks really pretty. I wouldn't mind a resin DD...